Home » MODDING HQ 1.13 » v1.13 Idea Incubation Lab  » New CTH system - Presentation
Re: New CTH system - Presentation[message #259100] Wed, 11 August 2010 06:12 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Mauser is currently offline Mauser

 
Messages:756
Registered:August 2006
Location: Bavaria - Germany
Brilliant dude!

that indeed looks quite awesome, like the "Ultimate Description Box"!

does your redesign mean we

[Updated on: Wed, 11 August 2010 06:15] by Moderator

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First Sergeant
Re: New CTH system - Presentation[message #259106] Wed, 11 August 2010 07:16 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Behrooz is currently offline Behrooz

 
Messages:8
Registered:March 2004
Love what you've done so far, Headrock!

A few quick comments:

- Some boundary conditions such as the duckbill attachment or 'match' grade ammunition could be dealt with via optional XML tags providing direct x/y axis scalars to bullet deviation.

;;Buckshot w/Duckbill
;;Results in a slightly broader but vertically flattened oval for buckshot pellets fired.

buckshotdeviation (x/y):  1.25 , 0.25 

;;'Match'-grade ammunition:
;;Reduces the bullet deviation consistently across both axes when using this specialty ammo.

bulletdeviation   (x/y):  0.80 , 0.80 


- IMO, the current penalties for using a scope at less than the ideal distance are too punitive, at least twice what I'd say is reasonable: There's a substantial overlap between the effective ranges of iron sights and 2x or even 4x scopes. A 2x scope is entirely reasonable at 40m, while against a man-sized target rifle iron sights can easily be used out past 100m+ (pistols... not so much).

- In that same general 'feeling', using 7 tiles as the 'normal' shooting range feels too short for me, at least when using long guns. Defining 'normal' on an individual weapon-by-weapon basis in the XMLs isn't really feasible, so I can think of two quick options:
A. Use 'range' to calculate the 'normal range'-- something like 10 * log(range of each gun) would put all of the guns between 10ish for the pistols to 20 for the big anti-material rifles.
B. Define the 'normal' shooting distance based on weapon class: pistol/MP/SMG/AR/rifle/MG/sniper. Something in the neighborhood of 7 / 9 / 10 / 12 / 16 / 12?

- I think the quickest way to get a general adjusted 'accuracy' for all of the guns in the XML is making a general 'reference' deviation for each caliber. Once that's hashed out, the only things I can think of that should affect bullet deviation are modifiers based on barrel length and a more subjective modifier for precision barrel manufacturing / quality materials.

- Alex's Russian weapon would be a great resource for judging the effect of barrel length, comparing the relative accuracy of AK-variants of different barrel lengths firing the same round. This could be somewhat generalized for other calibers.



Thanks again for putting all of this effort into making JA2 even better! Keep up the good work!

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Private
Re: New CTH system - Presentation[message #259107] Wed, 11 August 2010 07:48 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Minty is currently offline Minty

 
Messages:110
Registered:July 2009
Location: UK
It's looking fantastic, Headrock. Soooo much more info at our fingertips. Smile

One very minor quibble though.. The selected tab is the lo-lighted one, right? However, in most tabbed applications these days, the selected tab is highlighted, with the non-selected tabs being shaded/greyed out. Might want to swap the graphics to see how it looks?

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Sergeant
Re: New CTH system - Presentation[message #259125] Wed, 11 August 2010 12:01 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Beka is currently offline Beka

 
Messages:86
Registered:November 2009
Location: Vault 13
UDB together with NAS (and oc NCTH) will raise the possible micromanagement with guns by several 100%.

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Corporal 1st Class
Re: New CTH system - Presentation[message #259135] Wed, 11 August 2010 13:24 Go to previous messageGo to next message
smeagol is currently offline smeagol

 
Messages:2705
Registered:June 2008
Location: Bremen, Germany
Have you given any thought on adding an option to choose which of the 3 tables (description, properties, advanced) will be shown per default?


I know, I know... I already owe you my soul for a felt gazillion feature requests... but this could be very useful (imagine you're in sector invetory searching for the right gun... you would want to search for properties most likely and having to switch between description box and properties could be come very tedious... or just make it so, that it automatically uses the box last used when you opened the UDB).


Also color coding the "[color:#33CC00]perfect[/color]", "[color:#009900]good[/color]", "[color:#FFFF00]fair[/color]" "[color:#FF0000]terrible[/color]" conditon would be neat.

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Lieutenant

Re: New CTH system - Presentation[message #259158] Wed, 11 August 2010 14:02 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Headrock

 
Messages:1760
Registered:March 2006
Location: Jerusalem
Mauser
that indeed looks quite awesome, like the "Ultimate Description Box"!


Well, "Ultra" description box. It's certainly far from Ultimate. Some day though.

Mauser
does your redesign mean we

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Sergeant Major

Re: New CTH system - Presentation[message #259162] Wed, 11 August 2010 15:06 Go to previous messageGo to next message
smeagol is currently offline smeagol

 
Messages:2705
Registered:June 2008
Location: Bremen, Germany
Headrock
Aside from it being explained in the text above, I think I already explained it to you personally. The game remembers which page was last selected.



Uhm... yeah... my bad. Embarrassed

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Lieutenant

Re: New CTH system - Presentation[message #259171] Wed, 11 August 2010 15:48 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Headrock

 
Messages:1760
Registered:March 2006
Location: Jerusalem
On the other hand, I just implemented color variations for the Item Condition text.

PERFECT = White
EXCELLENT = Lt. Green
GOOD = Green
FAIR = Yellow
POOR = Orange
BAD = Light Red
TERRIBLE = Red

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Sergeant Major

Re: New CTH system - Presentation[message #259175] Wed, 11 August 2010 16:39 Go to previous messageGo to next message
CptMoore

 
Messages:224
Registered:March 2009
Since a weapon actually consists of different modules, the general tabs should have some sort of selection. Like you should be able to select which of the attachements you want to calculate bonus' for.. or in which mode.

Currently grenade launcher mode and shooting mode are the only two differentiated.

I of course would like to see more splitting of modes
* snapshot without scope (laser attachement bonus)
* fastshot with scope (laser doesn't apply?, only scope with least AP)
* scopeshot (scope which has best optimal range)

Oh the last point gives me another (additional) idea, what about having subtabs about ranges? Since each range is different, make the general tabs include a range selection and then you could display actual hit probability for each target size (prone, crouch, stand)?

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Sergeant 1st Class
Re: New CTH system - Presentation[message #259177] Wed, 11 August 2010 16:43 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Logisteric

 
Messages:3199
Registered:December 2008
Location: B
CptMoore
Since a weapon actually consists of different modules, the general tabs should have some sort of selection. Like you should be able to select which of the attachements you want to calculate bonus' for.. or in which mode.

Currently grenade launcher mode and shooting mode are the only two differentiated.

I of course would like to see more splitting of modes
* snapshot without scope (laser attachement bonus)
* fastshot with scope (laser doesn't apply?, only scope with least AP)
* scopeshot (scope which has best optimal range)

Oh the last point gives me another (additional) idea, what about having subtabs about ranges? Since each range is different, make the general tabs include a range selection and then you could display actual hit probability for each target size (prone, crouch, stand)?


yeah - gimme 4 minutes a shot

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Captain
Re: New CTH system - Presentation[message #259179] Wed, 11 August 2010 17:07 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Minty is currently offline Minty

 
Messages:110
Registered:July 2009
Location: UK
Headrock
Minty
One very minor quibble though.. The selected tab is the lo-lighted one, right? However, in most tabbed applications these days, the selected tab is highlighted, with the non-selected tabs being shaded/greyed out. Might want to swap the graphics to see how it looks?
There's one issue with that which would be impossible to overcome - the game's internal button system. I could swap the graphics, but the text on the button still moves slightly down and to the right when a button is pressed, to simulate it going "inwards". I would have to reverse the effect to achieve what you're talking about without making it look weird, and I don't think that's possible.

Ahh, no worries then. I didn't realise it was a hardcoded engine limitation. It's no massive thing, just a personal foible, definitely not a show-stopper. Smile

[Updated on: Wed, 11 August 2010 17:09] by Moderator

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Sergeant
Re: New CTH system - Presentation[message #259180] Wed, 11 August 2010 17:11 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Beka is currently offline Beka

 
Messages:86
Registered:November 2009
Location: Vault 13
Minty
... definitely not a show-stopper. Smile

Oh yes it is! It frustrates me so much I will stop playig JA2 from now on!!!
[/irony]

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Corporal 1st Class
Re: New CTH system - Presentation[message #259203] Wed, 11 August 2010 21:40 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Headrock

 
Messages:1760
Registered:March 2006
Location: Jerusalem
I've enhanced the tooltips a little. They now tell us not only what the icon stands for, but also what the statistic does in the game. This should make it easier for newcomers to understand all these crazy stats.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v726/Headrock/Jagged%20Alliance%202/HAM/HAM%204/UDB/Actual-Strategic_Gen_Gun_Tooltip.png

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Sergeant Major

Re: New CTH system - Presentation[message #259204] Wed, 11 August 2010 22:03 Go to previous messageGo to next message
cdudau
Give this man some money!

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Re: New CTH system - Presentation[message #259206] Wed, 11 August 2010 22:18 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Raktavijan is currently offline Raktavijan

 
Messages:25
Registered:July 2010
Location: Finland
Oh wow... Headrock, you've done some amazing work here. Surprised

I'm slightly confused as to all of the things but I was never good in understanding all the mumbojumbo anyway. Can't wait for this to go live someday. Very Happy

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Private 1st Class
Re: New CTH system - Presentation[message #259211] Wed, 11 August 2010 23:09 Go to previous messageGo to next message
lockie is currently offline lockie

 
Messages:3721
Registered:February 2006
Location: Scotland
Quote:
Please give feedback on UDB! Anything from layout to colors to questions about how it'll work are very much wanted, so say what you have to say.


Hurry up an get it released .

BTW , it looks great , for me , don't change anything , honestly , it looks really fine :ok:
Looking forward to release , oh , did I say that already.... :/

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Captain

Re: New CTH system - Presentation[message #259214] Wed, 11 August 2010 23:21 Go to previous messageGo to next message
svean is currently offline svean

 
Messages:63
Registered:August 2005
Everyone is waiting for this... have some patience people and give Headrock some room to finish this Smile

But seriously - I'm waiting for this more than for NAS with STOMP, AIM and new WF altogether... just to try it how it will work.

Great job anyway !!!

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Corporal
Re: New CTH system - Presentation[message #259223] Thu, 12 August 2010 00:51 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Flugente

 
Messages:3509
Registered:April 2009
Location: Germany
Looks totally awesome, thumbs up!

yeah, I too can't wait to play STOMP, HAM and NAS with NCTH. By the way...

If STOMP and HAM are now together, I guess it would be logical to include all 4. So while you're at it, you could perhaps prepare UDB for all those new weapon attachment slots (I assume they all will be merged together in the hopefully near future). Then you wouldn't have to do that later on.

I don't know if this would be feasible, but I can't think of anything else that can be improved on UDB, judging from your pictures Smile

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Captain

Re: New CTH system - Presentation[message #259232] Thu, 12 August 2010 01:31 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Sandro is currently offline Sandro

 
Messages:420
Registered:November 2008
Location: Mars
This all is amazing, Headrock!

Just two things cought my eye:
1) Expand the space for CONS and PROS in description tab, very often the interface does not show even a half of the weapons PROS by this time.
2) Make the selected tab highlighted and the other two grayed. Would look better, in my opinion.

Regards. And.. good job, man!

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Master Sergeant

Re: New CTH system - Presentation[message #259234] Thu, 12 August 2010 01:37 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Minty is currently offline Minty

 
Messages:110
Registered:July 2009
Location: UK
Check out Headrock's answer to my exact same suggestion at the top of the page, Sandro. Wink

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Sergeant
Re: New CTH system - Presentation[message #259239] Thu, 12 August 2010 01:46 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Sandro is currently offline Sandro

 
Messages:420
Registered:November 2008
Location: Mars
Aah, well then, it is possible to code it this way: flag those two buttons "pressed" and the remaining one not.. then show the tab referenced to the "not-pressed" button.
Headrock should know what I mean, it's actually very simple solution without messing with the entire button system.

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Master Sergeant

Re: New CTH system - Presentation[message #259246] Thu, 12 August 2010 02:47 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Headrock

 
Messages:1760
Registered:March 2006
Location: Jerusalem
Quote:
1) Expand the space for CONS and PROS in description tab, very often the interface does not show even a half of the weapons PROS by this time.


Tricky. It would need to wrap the line while creating it. Currently, it only replaces the end with "...". I've done it before, but it's a little complicated. Also, I'm still not sure there will be enough space for monkeying around once I try to fit this whole thing in the Tactical inventory.

In any case, there's always the tooltip (which always existed).

Quote:
Headrock should know what I mean


Yes, I do. Also tricky, but I think it might work. I could also replace the buttons with mouse regions (I.E. simulate buttons without actual buttons). But it's a lot of work, so I'm putting that low on the priorities list.

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Sergeant Major

Re: New CTH system - Presentation[message #259314] Thu, 12 August 2010 21:46 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Alex_SPB is currently offline Alex_SPB

 
Messages:169
Registered:February 2008
Location: Russia, St.Petersburg
Headrock,

I am sorry to say but I was sent to the business trip with really limited access to the Internet and very limited time. It would take something about 4-5 days to come back to home and to the forum as well.

Will post all workings as soon as possible.

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Staff Sergeant
Re: New CTH system - Presentation[message #259317] Thu, 12 August 2010 22:23 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Headrock

 
Messages:1760
Registered:March 2006
Location: Jerusalem
Don't worry about it. Especially because it's going to take a while to finish UDB anyway - at least at the rate I'm going. Smile

Lemme know when you're back though. I'll speed things up.

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Sergeant Major

Re: New CTH system - Presentation[message #259607] Mon, 16 August 2010 16:03 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Headrock

 
Messages:1760
Registered:March 2006
Location: Jerusalem
Just to keep this thread from falling back too far in the list ( Wink ), here's some in-game screenshots from UDB.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v726/Headrock/Jagged%20Alliance%202/HAM/HAM%204/UDB/Actual_Anim_Gun.gif

Guns usually have lots of data to display, making this the most interesting of all the UDB pages of course. You'll note that the last page displays info for the gun including all bonuses from the scope and laser. The -30% AP-to-Draw reduction of course comes from the gun itself.

The arrows on the right side are used whenever the list is too long to be displayed all at once. With NAS, it's quite possible that some guns will have very long lists.

By the way, in the picture you can see that all three values in the advanced tab columns are the same. However, once NCTH is completed, some items (like bipods, possibly folding stocks and so forth) will give different bonuses when standing, crouched, or prone. That's part of the point of this third page, and is really why UDB was created in the first place.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v726/Headrock/Jagged%20Alliance%202/HAM/HAM%204/UDB/Actual_Anim_Ammo.gif

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v726/Headrock/Jagged%20Alliance%202/HAM/HAM%204/UDB/Actual_Anim_Armor.gif

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v726/Headrock/Jagged%20Alliance%202/HAM/HAM%204/UDB/Actual_Anim_Explosive.gif

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v726/Headrock/Jagged%20Alliance%202/HAM/HAM%204/UDB/Actual_Anim_Misc.gif

Finally, as an added bonus, I've added a very small feature that is nonetheless a great improvement:

When looking at a gun or any item with attachments, then right-clicking one of the attachments, we get the Description Box for that attachment. This isn't new, that's how JA2 always worked. But with UDB, if we now CLOSE the attachment's description, we return to the description box of whatever item we started with.

This is unlike the original description box, where, if we wanted to examine the various attachments on a gun for instance, we'd have to open the gun, open attachment #1, close the box, open the gun again, open attachment #2, and so forth. The new system saves just one click, but it makes a big difference. That'll be especially true with NAS.

----------

I'm now going to continue work on UDB, to port it to the tactical screen. This should not be too much of a challenge, since I've designed UDB to fit comfortably in both screens with very minor adjustments. The only thing that actually changes shape/size are the tab buttons (DESCRIPTION/GENERAL/ADVANCED).
The real challenge of course would be to make the old description box function properly when UDB is disabled. That could take a week to get right, though I hope it will not take that long.

As a side note, I probably mentioned this before but here it is again: UDB completely replaces EDB. Like EDB, it will not be available in 640x480 screen modes. However, unlike EDB, it will also not be available in the Tactical Screen when using the Old Inventory system. That's due to the inventory panel being much shorter, thus allowing less vertical space which is obviously required by UDB... In the tactical screen for the old inventory, the old description box will always be shown instead of UDB.
My apologies to OIV players who've gotten used to having EDB in the tactical screen - it can't really be helped right now.

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Sergeant Major

Re: New CTH system - Presentation[message #259608] Mon, 16 August 2010 16:11 Go to previous messageGo to next message
smeagol is currently offline smeagol

 
Messages:2705
Registered:June 2008
Location: Bremen, Germany
AWESOME!

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Lieutenant

Re: New CTH system - Presentation[message #259609] Mon, 16 August 2010 16:14 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Maalstroom is currently offline Maalstroom

 
Messages:340
Registered:December 2008
Location: en route to San Hermanos
awesome! richtig! aber... can you make another collum in the advanced tab for the gun itself? so anybody can compare between the gun with no attachements and with attachements? that i think would be very useful!

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Master Sergeant
Re: New CTH system - Presentation[message #259611] Mon, 16 August 2010 16:48 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Headrock

 
Messages:1760
Registered:March 2006
Location: Jerusalem
@ Maalstrom: Unfortunately there isn't enough room for that. To do that, I would need to show, for EACH stance modifier, how much the gun gives and how much the attachment gives. This means 3 extra columns, and as you can see that's impossible.

But if anyone can draw a mock-up of how something like that should look, within the sizes dictated above, I'll certainly take that into consideration.

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Sergeant Major

Re: New CTH system - Presentation[message #259618] Mon, 16 August 2010 18:48 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Slax is currently offline Slax

 
Messages:1411
Registered:July 2006
Location: People riding polar bears...
Starting to look real good there, Headrock.

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Sergeant Major
Re: New CTH system - Presentation[message #259620] Mon, 16 August 2010 18:56 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Headrock

 
Messages:1760
Registered:March 2006
Location: Jerusalem
Yeah well this is just a bit of a distraction. I should've posted this in the HAM thread, although in essence it's just a supporting feature for NCTH. In the meanwhile of course this all just means that work on NCTH isn't really going anywhere...

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Sergeant Major

Re: New CTH system - Presentation[message #259622] Mon, 16 August 2010 19:06 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Faithless is currently offline Faithless

 
Messages:439
Registered:October 2009
Location: The safe end of the barre...
Are you diverting resources towards eye candy?!

Off to the gallows with you!

But while you're at it please include a "porn" icon, to indicate wether something can be used to bribe Brenda.

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Master Sergeant
Re: New CTH system - Presentation[message #259632] Mon, 16 August 2010 22:00 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Headrock

 
Messages:1760
Registered:March 2006
Location: Jerusalem
If it was only Eyecandy, I wouldn't have done it, especially since it postpones the release...

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Sergeant Major

Re: New CTH system - Presentation[message #259651] Mon, 16 August 2010 23:52 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Loucipher

 
Messages:157
Registered:October 2009
Yay. Blew me off my feet.

The new CTH is... well... reality brought back. Never liked this "to-hit chance" approach - it has this silly RPG-like feel to me. Now, at least we'll have something that models reality more closely.

The UDB may look like an eye candy, but it's much more - it's all the game innards laid bare. No item will be a secret with this. As if EDB was not enough... I'm already confused which sidearm to use, even with Weapon Comparison Guide in place!

Oh... wait... I have an idea! Very Happy

WarmSteel
Off to the gallows with you!


Nah... that'd be all too easy on him.

For this... he shall be sentenced to...

... writing a new, NCTH&UDB-enabled Weapon Comparison Guide!

How's that for a torment? Smile

Honestly though: Headrock... you ROCK. Big time. You should have been born 12 years earlier, lived in Canada and worked for Sir-Tech. We'd have the game made right to begin with Smile And by now, JA3 would have rolled out, made a bang and attain cult status, just like JA2.

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Staff Sergeant
Re: New CTH system - Presentation[message #259669] Tue, 17 August 2010 05:03 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Headrock

 
Messages:1760
Registered:March 2006
Location: Jerusalem
PROGRESS UPDATE

Work on UDB has just been completed, and it is functional as intended.

This means that NCTH is one step closer to completion.

The remaining steps are:

  • Reformatting the XMLs
    • Possibly the biggest task ahead, which requires adding at least three tags to every weapons in the game, and up to a dozen or more tags to each weapon attachment.
  • Tweaking the AI
    • The AI must be taught how to use the new CTH system, to avoid them firing a pistol at 50 tiles of range despite high CTH values. This sounds complicated, but really isn't - it's just a matter of finding the correct places to "intervene" and change them to measure CTH correctly.
  • Adjust OCTH-related mechanics
    • Things like damage output, penetration of objects, and experience gain are all dependent on a bullet's CTH value. However, the new system doesn't work the same way, so the value has to be treated differently by all those subsidiary systems as well. This is more of a thinking job: how to get those things working the same way as they did before but with a new value to work with?
  • Launchers and Throwing Knives
    • Both these weapon types used the OCTH system. With NCTH, I need to come up with a way to correctly calculate a Muzzle Sway value for them, and treat them accordingly once fired. This is a little more tricky than it sounds...
  • Sniper skill and other skill-related crap
    • The Sniper skill currently has no benefit in NCTH, simply because I haven't decided what to do with it yet. In addition, I need to work in the robot-skills (so that the robot's controller is the one whose skills are important for the robot's CTH...).
  • Tank, Robot, Crepitus
    • These "irregular" combatants should have their own modifiers for NCTH. So far I've received a few useful ideas about how to handle them, but not enough. I'll try to use what I've got (thanks to DepressiveBrot and others who've given ideas on this).

Bottom line: discussion.

Most importantly right now, things like the Sniper Skill and Special Combatants would be excellent. Of course, it would help if you could explain your ideas using the NCTH system as a guide.

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Sergeant Major

Re: New CTH system - Presentation[message #259670] Tue, 17 August 2010 05:15 Go to previous messageGo to next message
CptMoore

 
Messages:224
Registered:March 2009
Sniper skill: Zoom penalty and bonus' are better managed by a sniper. Sniper should have no problem aiming at moving targets. Sniper can aim at head/other bodyparts better than others.

I would distinguish between aiming at the body and a specific part.. if you try to aim at a specific part, as a non-sniper you actually loose accuracy.

Another idea is making drop-compensation accuracy dependant on the skill.. snipers have perfect drop compensation for rifles. Explosive guys are perfect with drop compensation with grenades (+GL). Throwing knife guys can compensate the throwing knife stuff.

This drop compensation eliminates the muzzle sway problem of the "gun" for throwing knifes.. since then only the shooters muzzle sway should count?

[Updated on: Tue, 17 August 2010 18:27] by Moderator

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Sergeant 1st Class
Re: New CTH system - Presentation[message #259701] Tue, 17 August 2010 16:27 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Maalstroom is currently offline Maalstroom

 
Messages:340
Registered:December 2008
Location: en route to San Hermanos
headrock you don't need gazillion collums, your so called advanced tab it's actually a "stance modifier tab" it only shows how the stance affects the gun parameters - for example a if a gun would have no attachements at all, your advanced tab should show how each stance is affecting the parameters of the gun - so with a naked gun you still have tree collums showing different values. but what you acctualy want is that your advanced tab is to show how the parameters of the gun are modified by everything - attachements, stance and (it should be) the user abilities to use that gun. for example ivan standing can fire a gun in a certain way - but the same ivan standing would not perform in the same way if he is tired (he had to run for a while). and each gun performs differently in each stance and in each stance the gun performs differently from standard conditions - which is the singel collum i've requested. you just need a collum which show parameters for a fixed (standard testing position). just one not tree! just think about it!

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Master Sergeant
Re: New CTH system - Presentation[message #259712] Tue, 17 August 2010 18:38 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Headrock

 
Messages:1760
Registered:March 2006
Location: Jerusalem
Quote:
but what you acctualy want is that your advanced tab is to show how the parameters of the gun are modified by everything - attachements, stance and (it should be) the user abilities to use that gun.


Actually no, it (that is, the game) doesn't work like that at all.

Firstly, it is impossible to take a shooter's skills into account when showing the box - because a description box can be shown for items in the sector pool, or items in a shopkeeper's inventory, and in both cases there's no one holding the gun. So for the few attributes that do depend on shooter stats (namely, AP costs), a static average value is used.

Secondly, no, the advanced tab does NOT show how the parameters of the gun are adjusted. In fact, that's what the General tab is for. And that shows the base value (without attachments), the attachment/ammo modifier, and the final value.

The Advanced Tab is used to show modifiers coming from ammo, attachments, and inherent abilities of the gun, including modifiers that are not related to the gun's performance. For instance, increased vision range. Most of them do not act on any property of the gun - they usually act on the shooter himself, and as such cannot be displayed the same way that General Stats are. Therefore, the advanced tab is used mostly for items that do not have their own general properties, like attachments.

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Sergeant Major

Re: New CTH system - Presentation[message #259718] Tue, 17 August 2010 20:56 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Maalstroom is currently offline Maalstroom

 
Messages:340
Registered:December 2008
Location: en route to San Hermanos
i apologize then! i missunderstood some of you intentions!

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Master Sergeant
Re: New CTH system - Presentation[message #259785] Wed, 18 August 2010 15:50 Go to previous messageGo to next message
GeneralArthur is currently offline GeneralArthur

 
Messages:11
Registered:January 2008
Location: Potchefstroom, South Afri...
This is shaping up to be quite something...can barely contain my excitement!

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Private
Re: New CTH system - Presentation[message #259901] Thu, 19 August 2010 22:23 Go to previous messageGo to previous message
Snake Plissken is currently offline Snake Plissken

 
Messages:37
Registered:December 2001
Read the presentation, I'm sold.

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Private 1st Class
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