Home » MODDING HQ 1.13 » v1.13 Idea Incubation Lab  » HAM 4.0 Alpha Testing Thread
HAM 4.0 Alpha Testing Thread[message #262052] Thu, 09 September 2010 22:45 Go to next message
Headrock

 
Messages:1760
Registered:March 2006
Location: Jerusalem
This thread will be used to coordinate and track the Alpha testing phase of HAM 4.0. This opening post will be updated as necessary throughout the process.

Do not post here for questions about HAM or discussions about its features. There are threads for those kinds of things.

----------------------------------

HAM 4.0 is gearing up for an Alpha release. This will be a CLOSED alpha, with limited participation. Assuming no (more) unforeseen problems occur, the Alpha phase will begin before the end of next week.

Of course, the first step is to recruit Alpha testers. Since this is a closed release, not everyone will get a chance to play-test HAM 4 at this stage.

Volunteers will be recruited based on whether or not they can be trusted to give good feedback, test things to the limit, and know how to handle minor problems (including minor installation issues). However, you are urged to volunteer nonetheless, just in case.

What will the process include?

1. Download and installation HAM 4.0a
  • A clean installation of JA2 1.13 is required, to avoid errors unrelated to HAM.
  • HAM 4.0a will be distributed as a package containing all files from the 1.13 cutting-edge Beta version, as well as HAM's own unique files. The package is roughly 20MB in size.
  • HAM 4.0a will have a separate directory for its "special" files, but WILL overwrite files in the DATA and DATA-1.13 directory with the needed files from the 1.13 Beta Project. You will not be able to go back to "plain" 1.13, unless you're good enough with the VFS system to know how to setup those files in a separate directory.
2. Playing HAM 4.0a
  • The idea of course is to try out HAM 4.0a to see whether it's stable. Of course, part of the point is to push the boundaries when you can, just to see what happens.
  • HAM 4.0a runs on top of the 1.13 Beta Project. That means it includes STOMP, NAS, and all other new features that are in that project.
  • STOMP use is highly unrecommended, since HAM somewhat cripples the more shooting-oriented traits (like Marksman).
  • It is currently impossible to play HAM 4.0a with Wildfire or the AIM mod. That would require editing the Items.XML and Weapons.XML files to HAM properties. You can play without modifying those files, but all your weapons will have lousy accuracy and no recoil, making the game unbalanced. Also, most attachments will do absolutely nothing.
3. Tweaking
  • While this IS an Alpha test, which is meant to discover bugs, it is nonetheless important to get it balanced. This means determining whether ranged combat works well or whether it's annoying in any way.
  • A tester must be capable of editing INI files. Playing around with CTHConstants.INI (supplied by HAM 4.0a) is part of this.
  • Items.XML and Weapons.XML are not optimized - they may make items/weapons unbalanced. Be prepared to make edits to these, though it's not absolutely required. If you have the mind for these things, you'll surely enjoy all the options NCTH has to offer.
4. Reporting bugs
  • Naturally, the idea of Alpha testing is to fish out bugs that I missed. While some things may already be known (see below), you're absolutely guaranteed to find things that are a little weird or completely nonfunctional (hopefully no CTDs).
  • Any error you encounter that is not already listed as "known" in this post must be reported so I can fix it. Report what you were doing, what happened, and if possibly what error message you received (in as much detail as possible).
  • Be prepared to upload savegames. This is absolutely required. If you have no place to put savegames for download, you can send them directly to me. ALWAYS post the bug description IN THIS THREAD before sending any savegames.
  • Push the limits. Try things that aren't logical, do things you don't usually do, just to see what happens.


KNOWN BUGS OR EXPECTED ERRORS

HAM 4.0a is not guaranteed to be bug-free. In fact, it's pretty much guaranteed to have SOME issues here and there. While they probably won't crash your game, they might. It's actually important to try and cause errors to happen during Alpha Testing.

Here is a list of things you can EXPECT to go wrong, or small errors that have yet to be fixed. As a good alpha tester, try to trigger such an error at least once and report your findings here (even if nothing bad happened!).

  • Robot shooting skills: The robot currently uses its own skills to shoot, rather than the skills of the person holding the remote control.
  • STOMP traits nerfed: Some of the new STOMP traits don't give all the bonuses they should - particularly bonuses related to shooting.
  • Missing Recoil Percent Modifier: This effect does not appear in UDB yet. It DOES work, however.
  • No toggle for map colors: The strategic map is currently displayed in GREY. Explored sectors appear in color. This will remain until the beta.
  • Throwing Knives, Launchers, GL Bursts: These may or may not work at all. It's important to test what happens when they are used, nonetheless!
  • Stabbing weapons and Melee Weapons: May or may not display aiming indicators or other important indicators. Still, test them and make suggestions.
  • UDB for Shopkeeper's Interface: UDB does not work properly in this interface (it draws only part-way on screen). Actually, ODB may not work well either when NAS is used.
  • Cursor text truncated: One or more non-shooting-related cursors appear strange due to STI changes.
  • Black targeting cursor invisible: The black targeting cursor for "shot blocked" is apparently missing or invisible.

More known bugs will be posted here as they are discovered.

Report message to a moderator

Sergeant Major

Re: HAM 4.0 Alpha Testing Thread[message #262068] Fri, 10 September 2010 00:47 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Headrock

 
Messages:1760
Registered:March 2006
Location: Jerusalem
So erm... volunteers, post here. Smile

Report message to a moderator

Sergeant Major

Re: HAM 4.0 Alpha Testing Thread[message #262069] Fri, 10 September 2010 00:53 Go to previous messageGo to next message
silversurfer

 
Messages:2793
Registered:May 2009
Question: Do you plan to publish the source code at the start of the alpha test? To me this is important because if something goes wrong during play I actually like to look for the reason inside the code and fix it if possible.

Report message to a moderator

Lieutenant
Re: HAM 4.0 Alpha Testing Thread[message #262073] Fri, 10 September 2010 01:18 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Headrock

 
Messages:1760
Registered:March 2006
Location: Jerusalem
Quote:
Question: Do you plan to publish the source code at the start of the alpha test? To me this is important because if something goes wrong during play I actually like to look for the reason inside the code and fix it if possible.


While I'm aware that would help, the answer is no. Sorry, it would just get too complicated.

However, if serious bugs appear which I can't debug myself, I will distribute the alpha code so people can debug on their own machines.

Report message to a moderator

Sergeant Major

Re: HAM 4.0 Alpha Testing Thread[message #262084] Fri, 10 September 2010 03:08 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Behrooz is currently offline Behrooz

 
Messages:8
Registered:March 2004
I'll volunteer. The work you've been putting into NCTH/UDB has had me drooling for weeks! Even better, I was going to try some new mods and just happen to have a new install ready to crash and burn!

Report message to a moderator

Private
Re: HAM 4.0 Alpha Testing Thread[message #262085] Fri, 10 September 2010 03:14 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Ormus n2o is currently offline Ormus n2o

 
Messages:28
Registered:March 2010
Location: Poland; Wielkopolska; Pi&...
I thought that there will by like 3 pages of posts after one hour Razz. Looks like you scare them all with all this rules and restrictions. I want to help badly but i wait to new computer so i'm offline to everything except reading forums and watching YT Razz. This is not fun at all.

http://forum.jagged-alliance.pl/ham-4-0-alpha-testing-t2321.html

I make new Recruiting Center on Polish Official Jagged Alliance site.

[Updated on: Fri, 10 September 2010 03:23] by Moderator

Report message to a moderator

Private 1st Class
Re: HAM 4.0 Alpha Testing Thread[message #262087] Fri, 10 September 2010 04:27 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Headrock

 
Messages:1760
Registered:March 2006
Location: Jerusalem
Quote:
Looks like you scare them all with all this rules and restrictions.


Good. I only need people who are serious enough to take it on. It's not "for shits and giggles", it's Alpha Testing.

Quote:
I make new Recruiting Center on Polish Official Jagged Alliance site.


Well I did say I would only be taking people whom I can trust to do this properly... With no offense meant to people on the polish forums, I probably don't know most of them enough to trust them with this.

I do already have one Polish tester though, but then again he's doing some really important work for the project anyway so I'd better trust him! Very Happy

Report message to a moderator

Sergeant Major

Re: HAM 4.0 Alpha Testing Thread[message #262088] Fri, 10 September 2010 05:22 Go to previous messageGo to next message
johno is currently offline johno

 
Messages:44
Registered:August 2007
I would like to help test it

edit: i suppose because ncth is going to be so popular i should give some points to why you should choose me
i've done alpha testing at games studio's (biggest was creative assembly)
im studying computer game design at university
got some free time and wont let you down Smile

[Updated on: Fri, 10 September 2010 05:28] by Moderator

Report message to a moderator

Corporal
Re: HAM 4.0 Alpha Testing Thread[message #262093] Fri, 10 September 2010 10:09 Go to previous messageGo to next message
ChonkE is currently offline ChonkE

 
Messages:17
Registered:January 2008
Location: Utah
I am not sure how much time I can devote but I'll do whatever I can to help you along man.

Report message to a moderator

Private
Re: HAM 4.0 Alpha Testing Thread[message #262130] Fri, 10 September 2010 20:30 Go to previous messageGo to next message
silversurfer

 
Messages:2793
Registered:May 2009
Headrock
Quote:
Question: Do you plan to publish the source code at the start of the alpha test? To me this is important because if something goes wrong during play I actually like to look for the reason inside the code and fix it if possible.


While I'm aware that would help, the answer is no. Sorry, it would just get too complicated.


Too bad. I was hoping that I could see if the NCTH fixes a few bugs with LOS and CTH calculation which are still open on JaggZilla. To be precise I mean #238 and #255.

I won't volunteer because I ain't got the time for thorough testing but I hope you find enough good testers. :thumbsup:

Report message to a moderator

Lieutenant
Re: HAM 4.0 Alpha Testing Thread[message #262135] Fri, 10 September 2010 20:42 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Headrock

 
Messages:1760
Registered:March 2006
Location: Jerusalem
Quote:
I was hoping that I could see if the NCTH fixes a few bugs with LOS and CTH calculation which are still open on JaggZilla.


Those are the ones related to sightrange through thick grass, yes? If so, it'll be BETTER than the old system (which relied a lot more on sight), but I don't think it FIXES the problem.

Report message to a moderator

Sergeant Major

Re: HAM 4.0 Alpha Testing Thread[message #262203] Sat, 11 September 2010 13:46 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Flugente

 
Messages:3509
Registered:April 2009
Location: Germany
Hi Headrock, I'd be glad to help testing. I'm in.

Report message to a moderator

Captain

Re: HAM 4.0 Alpha Testing Thread[message #262258] Sat, 11 September 2010 20:17 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Animus is currently offline Animus
Messages:2
Registered:January 2010
Location: Australia
Hi Headrock
I am willing to alpha test.
I own JA2,can do all the installing, can use SVN and have a decent amout of time available.
Also i would enjoy it.

[Updated on: Sat, 28 May 2011 11:43] by Moderator

Report message to a moderator

Civilian
Re: HAM 4.0 Alpha Testing Thread[message #262316] Sun, 12 September 2010 10:22 Go to previous messageGo to next message
ko5ma

 
Messages:35
Registered:January 2010
Location: Poland
After a quick session - it's fantastic. I really like the way guns behave on full auto - Ivan's AK visibly pulls up. Aimed autofire is ridiculously overpowered and amazingly fun at the same time - Stephen took a redshirt down with a 6rd burst from a MP41 at 23 tiles, no problem Smile. Then again, it balances out with huge ammo consumption... It was my first time to run out of ammo in Omerta Very Happy.

Two bugs so far, one already reported, UDB reliability shows loudness instead:
http://img535.imageshack.us/img535/5193/screen001j.jpg

And one new (?), graphical glitch with doors (100% reproductable, didn't happen before HAM):
http://img267.imageshack.us/img267/8721/screen000es.jpg

[Updated on: Sun, 12 September 2010 10:23] by Moderator

Report message to a moderator

Private 1st Class
Re: HAM 4.0 Alpha Testing Thread[message #262340] Sun, 12 September 2010 16:47 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Headrock

 
Messages:1760
Registered:March 2006
Location: Jerusalem
Quote:
UDB reliability shows loudness instead


Fixed for next version. Also, Reliability and Repair Ease will now show "--" instead of 0 on the left column if the item has a zero value. It will still show 0 on the right (in the white column).

Quote:
graphical glitch with doors


This must have something to do with my messing with the aiming cursor... Wow I seriously hope I can fix that.

Quote:
Aimed autofire is ridiculously overpowered


Yes, especially in the early game. My hope is that it should make the early game a little easier (all the Drassen Counterattack and so forth) but be much more dangerous later thanks to AI with suppression fire (They do that a LOT now). So let me know how it turns out.

P.S. to all those who want to reduce the lethality of autofire, you can decrease the value "RECOIL_MAX_COUNTER_FORCE" which is found in DATA-HAM-40\CTHConstants.INI. The lower it goes, the harder it gets to control autofiring guns. Of course, bipods counteract this...

In the future (I.E. next version) there will be a way to control Counter-Force accuracy the same way, with possibly better results.

[EDIT] Also, it appears I left a debug value in the INI files: RECOIL_COUNTER_FREQUENCY was set to 1, allowing soldiers much more accurate autofire than they should have. I've removed this value entirely since it wasn't really needed to begin with. Recoil Counter-force Frequency is now determined based on the gun's B/5AP value, so guns that shoot faster waste more bullets now.

Patch being prepared now.

Report message to a moderator

Sergeant Major

Re: HAM 4.0 Alpha Testing Thread[message #262342] Sun, 12 September 2010 17:24 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Headrock

 
Messages:1760
Registered:March 2006
Location: Jerusalem
PACKAGE UPDATE

Version 2 is available at the same link as before.

If you've forgotten the link, give me a PM and I'll send it to you.

Remember to keep the link because updates will use the same one every time.

Change Log v1 -> v2:

  • Fixed UDB error when showing a gun's Reliability and Repair Ease
  • Removed CTH Constant "RECOIL_COUNTER_FREQUENCY"
  • Recoil CF Frequency now depends on the weapon's B/5AP value.

Report message to a moderator

Sergeant Major

Re: HAM 4.0 Alpha Testing Thread[message #262346] Sun, 12 September 2010 18:20 Go to previous messageGo to next message
ko5ma

 
Messages:35
Registered:January 2010
Location: Poland
Found another bug. When creating an IMP, skills and attributes start at the minimum value, but instead of immediately going to 0 when further lowered they are decreased by 1 until they reach 0. Subsequently, it is not possible to increase them from 0 - the cost is removed from skill point pool, but value stays at 0.

EDIT:
And yet another one: despite choosing a personality trait when creating IMPs, it is displayed as "neutral" on the merc info panel.

EDIT2:
One more issue, not really a bug though. I always set the global damage multipliers to 150/125/125 in JA2.ini. It seems that this is now displayed in UDB in the "bonus" part, rather than simply added to the base value - i suppose that'd make more sense.

EDIT3:
And one more, the black "impossible shot" aiming reticle is missing, only the firing cost is displayed.

EDIT4:
Loudness modifier (sound suppressors) is displayed in red, as "+75%", despite the description saying "lower is better".

[Updated on: Sun, 12 September 2010 18:53] by Moderator

Report message to a moderator

Private 1st Class
Re: HAM 4.0 Alpha Testing Thread[message #262351] Sun, 12 September 2010 19:56 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Headrock

 
Messages:1760
Registered:March 2006
Location: Jerusalem
Quote:
Found another bug. When creating an IMP, skills and attributes start at the minimum value, but instead of immediately going to 0 when further lowered they are decreased by 1 until they reach 0. Subsequently, it is not possible to increase them from 0 - the cost is removed from skill point pool, but value stays at 0.

EDIT:
And yet another one: despite choosing a personality trait when creating IMPs, it is displayed as "neutral" on the merc info panel.


That doesn't sound like anything HAM 4 should be related to... Can anyone test the 1.13 Beta Version without HAM to see what happens? (To do this, simply change the JA2.INI VFS setting back to the original file)

Quote:
One more issue, not really a bug though. I always set the global damage multipliers to 150/125/125 in JA2.ini. It seems that this is now displayed in UDB in the "bonus" part, rather than simply added to the base value - i suppose that'd make more sense.


True - it should be part of the weapon's base value. I'll fix that.

Quote:
And one more, the black "impossible shot" aiming reticle is missing, only the firing cost is displayed.


It actually IS displayed, behind the AP cost. The cursor is much smaller now. Not sure how to fix that without making things ugly when shooting outside range (where the red cursor alternates with the black one)

Quote:
Loudness modifier (sound suppressors) is displayed in red, as "+75%", despite the description saying "lower is better".


Correct - the loudness modifier is actually called "Loudness Reduction", and is better when HIGHER. I'll change that though - the modifier will stay the same in the XML, but will appear reversed in UDB (I.E. "-75%" instead of "+75%", and in green).

Report message to a moderator

Sergeant Major

Re: HAM 4.0 Alpha Testing Thread[message #262352] Sun, 12 September 2010 20:05 Go to previous messageGo to next message
ko5ma

 
Messages:35
Registered:January 2010
Location: Poland
Headrock
Quote:
And one more, the black "impossible shot" aiming reticle is missing, only the firing cost is displayed.


It actually IS displayed, behind the AP cost. The cursor is much smaller now. Not sure how to fix that without making things ugly when shooting outside range (where the red cursor alternates with the black one)

I'm afraid that's not true - you can see it easily when out of combat mode. I marked the place where the aiming cursor should be. It does correctly display the grey one while mouse is moving though.
http://img541.imageshack.us/img541/9079/screen000f.jpg

EDIT:
And another thing probably unrelated to HAM - setting the early rebel recruitment option results in a free 2 level experience gain for all mercs... Not sure if it can be avoided.

[Updated on: Sun, 12 September 2010 20:14] by Moderator

Report message to a moderator

Private 1st Class
Re: HAM 4.0 Alpha Testing Thread[message #262356] Sun, 12 September 2010 21:24 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Goumindong is currently offline Goumindong

 
Messages:5
Registered:September 2010
I would enjoy alpha testing if you're willing to have me. Though my play time during the week is typically fairly low.

Report message to a moderator

Private
Re: HAM 4.0 Alpha Testing Thread[message #262364] Sun, 12 September 2010 22:34 Go to previous messageGo to next message
silversurfer

 
Messages:2793
Registered:May 2009
ko5ma

EDIT:
And another thing probably unrelated to HAM - setting the early rebel recruitment option results in a free 2 level experience gain for all mercs... Not sure if it can be avoided.


This is STOMP related. STOMP added a feature to reward experience points for completing certain quests.
Look for "AWARD_SPECIAL_EXP_POINTS_FOR_COMPLETING_QUESTS" in JA2_Options.ini. You can set it to 0 to disable the feature.

Report message to a moderator

Lieutenant
Re: HAM 4.0 Alpha Testing Thread[message #262372] Sun, 12 September 2010 23:08 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Headrock

 
Messages:1760
Registered:March 2006
Location: Jerusalem
Damn that's quite a huge experience gain!!

Report message to a moderator

Sergeant Major

Re: HAM 4.0 Alpha Testing Thread[message #262381] Sun, 12 September 2010 23:38 Go to previous messageGo to next message
ko5ma

 
Messages:35
Registered:January 2010
Location: Poland
It's probably because it counts as 4 quests (?)...

Report message to a moderator

Private 1st Class
Re: HAM 4.0 Alpha Testing Thread[message #262407] Mon, 13 September 2010 02:34 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Headrock

 
Messages:1760
Registered:March 2006
Location: Jerusalem
PACKAGE UPDATE

Version 3 is available at the same link as before.

Change Log v2 -> v3:
  • New CTH Constant: RECOIL_COUNTER_ACCURACY_MIN_ERROR, a multiplier for the gun's (total) recoil that determines the maximum accuracy anyone can have when trying to control a burst/auto volley. Default set to 0.2 (20% of the gun's total recoil).
  • Shot offset messages are now toggled by an options menu setting.
  • Alternate map colors are now toggled by an options menu setting.
  • UDB fix: INI-based weapons damage modifiers now included in "basic" weapon damage displayed.
    In addition, Damage Modifiers also grow in proportion to the INI setting now (not just in UDB!).
  • UDB fix: "Loudness Modifier" now shown GREEN and NEGATIVE when it reduces loudness, as intended.
  • UDB fix: "Reliability Modifier" in the ADVANCED page now shows its values (previously, only an
    icon was shown)

---------------------------------

Quote:
Found another bug. When creating an IMP, skills and attributes start at the minimum value, but instead of immediately going to 0 when further lowered they are decreased by 1 until they reach 0. Subsequently, it is not possible to increase them from 0 - the cost is removed from skill point pool, but value stays at 0.

EDIT:
And yet another one: despite choosing a personality trait when creating IMPs, it is displayed as "neutral" on the merc info panel.


I couldn't reproduce the second bug at all. However I did experience lots of issues with the first bug when trying to create an IMP, and I also have a guess why this happens - it has to do with a new feature that Sandro introduced into STOMP (and apparently has found its way into the 1.13 beta very recently) where merc stats start with random values and can't be shifted by a large enough amount. Apparently part of that system is interfering with IMP creation even when STOMP traits are turned off.

BTW, just as a reminder - please don't use STOMP traits with HAM 4, until it is adapted for the new system.

Report message to a moderator

Sergeant Major

Re: HAM 4.0 Alpha Testing Thread[message #262419] Mon, 13 September 2010 03:45 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Headrock

 
Messages:1760
Registered:March 2006
Location: Jerusalem
I've just done something which I think a lot of you are going to appreciate. You've probably been frustrated about this in the past at least once, and now it's finally possible.

Shift-Click the "NEXT" button in a Bobby Ray's item list, and you skip forward 5 pages.
Shift-Click the "PREV" button to skip back 5 pages.

Works like a charm, took 10 minutes to set up.

This feature will be available in the upcoming version.

Report message to a moderator

Sergeant Major

Re: HAM 4.0 Alpha Testing Thread[message #262420] Mon, 13 September 2010 03:59 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Ormus n2o is currently offline Ormus n2o

 
Messages:28
Registered:March 2010
Location: Poland; Wielkopolska; Pi&...
i have same bug like ko5ma Btw. Also if u get keep clicking to get less points when u have 0 points u get free 15 points. This lead to such overpowered mercs Razz
http://img821.imageshack.us/img821/3791/impcreation.jpg
There is also a little graphic glith. Just for knowing. Not a issue at all.
http://img836.imageshack.us/img836/5170/glith.jpg
A big issue is that cursor is very preety and all but information on it are hard to read. Lack of CTH or Muzzle stability number. Now lack of it hited me preety hard Razz.
As i said new cursor is very good looking. But it is hard to guess u hance to hit. Mayby i need used to it.
Bullet trajectory is very funny too Razz

Now there is a big one. Thompson have 4 extra aiming levels. Without aiming muzzle stability is 0, with one it is 25 but with 2 and 3 aimings muzzle stability is still 25 although i spend AP. With 4 it is 50. Here is save http://www.sendspace.pl/file/455082fd78d8ccb4c2578b8
Range is 22/20 so it is 2 tiles beyond.

There was some funny things too Razz. I hited guy in head from pistol. But it was 35 tiles away i think Razz. And second was that 2 mercs was inside a house and one enemy rush on my mercs. Ofcours they got interupt and tried to shot him form pistols (enemy was 7 tiles away). Tried aim in the head but almost alwas my mercs missed. I hited him 2 times in head for 0 hp and once for 1 hp. Then in next round Steroid shoot him in chest for 3 ... (guns need to by ballanced i think) and enemy goes unconscious. Next 3 round i spend in shooting to the unconscious guy. Does it is random or ballance problems? Cuz headshots are fairly easy to get on very far distants?

@Edit
There is one ballance problem/idea. Heavy attachment and amunition should reduce recoil. It is easier to move object that have less weight. And if u shoot 9 mm round from 4 pound gun it has 2 times more recoil if u shoot from 8 pound gun. Strenght and mass of merc do the same.

@Edit second
How does Projection Factor do? I mean does it make alot easier to hit? I think it should incrase Muzzle Stability without aiming and not giving nothing on aimed shoots or something. Cuz u can see were u weapon is target even without actualy looking through scope/match sight.

@Another Edit
Small balance issue (i think) M40 have 89 accurate and MGS90A1 have 90. MGS90A1 is considered a most accurate semi+automatic rifle and is definitely more accurate than M40. Cuz Military standards are less restrict than Police standards.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Mao1.png
And one point is not much.

[Updated on: Mon, 13 September 2010 05:09] by Moderator

Report message to a moderator

Private 1st Class
Re: HAM 4.0 Alpha Testing Thread[message #262421] Mon, 13 September 2010 07:40 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Headrock

 
Messages:1760
Registered:March 2006
Location: Jerusalem
Quote:
There is also a little graphic glith. Just for knowing. Not a issue at all.
http://img836.imageshack.us/img836/5170/glith.jpg


... Where's the glitch?

Quote:
Thompson have 4 extra aiming levels. Without aiming muzzle stability is 0, with one it is 25 but with 2 and 3 aimings muzzle stability is still 25 although i spend AP. With 4 it is 50.


That's CTH estimation by Bull, thanks to his lowsy Wisdom and EXP level. You can turn it off somewhere, I think in the INI files? It's one of my older features (circa HAM 2.0)

Quote:
I hited him 2 times in head for 0 hp and once for 1 hp. Then in next round Steroid shoot him in chest for 3 ...


That's... weird. I think it's a combination of the enemy wearing armor, and CTH being used in determining damage, though I can't really explain that. Actually a savegame at that point would've really helped.

Quote:
There is one ballance problem/idea. Heavy attachment and amunition should reduce recoil.


Yes, in theory this is true, but since aimed autofire is already so good, that may not be the best idea. Smile

Quote:
How does Projection Factor do? I mean does it make alot easier to hit? I think it should incrase Muzzle Stability without aiming and not giving nothing on aimed shoots or something. Cuz u can see were u weapon is target even without actualy looking through scope/match sight.


A projection factor is a direct multiplier which works similar to scope magnification. If you have 1.2x from a laser, all shots will be 1.2x more accurate (a 20% bonus). Like with scopes, you need at least one aim click to get the bonus. Unlike scopes, it works up to the indicated range (1.2x normal = 1.2 * 7 = Cool, and beyond that it rapidly dissipates.

Report message to a moderator

Sergeant Major

Re: HAM 4.0 Alpha Testing Thread[message #262427] Mon, 13 September 2010 10:29 Go to previous messageGo to next message
tais

 
Messages:656
Registered:February 2008
Location: NL
Headrock
I've just done something which I think a lot of you are going to appreciate. You've probably been frustrated about this in the past at least once, and now it's finally possible.

Shift-Click the "NEXT" button in a Bobby Ray's item list, and you skip forward 5 pages.
Shift-Click the "PREV" button to skip back 5 pages.

Works like a charm, took 10 minutes to set up.

This feature will be available in the upcoming version.


could you also add a ctrl + click on an item so you immediatly buy all of that item?

Report message to a moderator

First Sergeant

Re: HAM 4.0 Alpha Testing Thread[message #262428] Mon, 13 September 2010 10:30 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Logisteric

 
Messages:3199
Registered:December 2008
Location: B
i'm all for that

edith:

i even think it would be better if [ctrl]-[click] was for buying just one and [click] for buying all of it

[Updated on: Mon, 13 September 2010 10:44] by Moderator

Report message to a moderator

Captain
Re: HAM 4.0 Alpha Testing Thread[message #262445] Mon, 13 September 2010 14:45 Go to previous messageGo to next message
ko5ma

 
Messages:35
Registered:January 2010
Location: Poland
Ormus
@Another Edit
Small balance issue (i think) M40 have 89 accurate and MGS90A1 have 90. MGS90A1 is considered a most accurate semi+automatic rifle and is definitely more accurate than M40. Cuz Military standards are less restrict than Police standards.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Mao1.png
And one point is not much.

Actually, one point at higher ranges is quite a a big difference. Also, M40 is not semiautomatic, and MSG90 might have been considered most accurate, but that was 20 years ago, in HK brochures... ;> In any case, it is set to its realistic accuracy (1MOA, which is equal to bAccuracy of 90).

Re very low damage at short ranges - happens to me a lot with low-tier mercs. I'll try to reproduce and upload a savegame - but now that the randomizer is reseeded at every load it may not be 100% repeatable.

Report message to a moderator

Private 1st Class
Re: HAM 4.0 Alpha Testing Thread[message #262451] Mon, 13 September 2010 16:04 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Ormus n2o is currently offline Ormus n2o

 
Messages:28
Registered:March 2010
Location: Poland; Wielkopolska; Pi&...
Headrock

... Where's the glitch?

Just Aiming circle is cuted.
I found bug with autofire. It allow to shoot 100-200 rounds autofire using only 35-40 Ap. I give save for better understanding. And i use cheats but i don't think this is relvant. It work both with FN Minimi and HK 416. Also i'm not certain but autofire is a little weak. With that 200 bullet fire i hit eliot only few times with FN minimi.
http://www.sendspace.com/file/3jud55\

@edit
suddenly autofire work now just fine.
http://www.sendspace.com/file/b0uwx1
I have no idea why.

[Updated on: Mon, 13 September 2010 16:11] by Moderator

Report message to a moderator

Private 1st Class
Re: HAM 4.0 Alpha Testing Thread[message #262452] Mon, 13 September 2010 17:09 Go to previous messageGo to next message
ko5ma

 
Messages:35
Registered:January 2010
Location: Poland
Were you firing with a bipod, from a prone position? Most guns have Y recoil calculated from real values (projectile velocity, projectile mass, powder load, ejecta velocity -> projectile momentum -> weapon momentum -> weapon velocity -> recoil energy), but MG's are an exception to this due to balance reasons. You're not supposed to be able to hit anything with long bursts unsupported.

Report message to a moderator

Private 1st Class
Re: HAM 4.0 Alpha Testing Thread[message #262453] Mon, 13 September 2010 17:14 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Ormus n2o is currently offline Ormus n2o

 
Messages:28
Registered:March 2010
Location: Poland; Wielkopolska; Pi&...
I don't remember. I gues you're right. Firing from HK 416 was more accurate cuz i used foregrip. But that unlimited autofire is not dependable from stance position.

Report message to a moderator

Private 1st Class
Re: HAM 4.0 Alpha Testing Thread[message #262464] Mon, 13 September 2010 19:31 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Headrock

 
Messages:1760
Registered:March 2006
Location: Jerusalem
Quote:
Just Aiming circle is cuted.


Oh that's not really a glitch, it's just being cut to avoid obscuring the aiming pips and autofire bullets. That will change when I have the time for it.

Quote:
I found bug with autofire. It allow to shoot 100-200 rounds autofire using only 35-40 Ap. I give save for better understanding. And i use cheats but i don't think this is relvant. It work both with FN Minimi and HK 416.


I was hunting for this bug with Smeagol, but couldn't succeed. Your savegame was very handy for figuring this one out.

The problem turned out to be with Zilpin's Max-Autofire feature (whether you activate it or not). Part of his system works by increasing your soldier's Autofire Bullets setting to the maximum (given how many bullets are left in the gun), and then checking whether he has enough APs to do so. If he doesn't have enough APs, the number of bullets is reduced by one and the program again checks if he has enough APs for that much. And so on and so on.

The problem appears to be with guns that have a large magazine (Smeagol encountered it with the WildFire American-180). When using such guns, the calculated AP cost to attack with ALL the bullets is way above 255AP. So when calculated, the program encounters 8-bit integers and the number gets warped, so the program thinks you have enough APs to fire ALL the bullets!!

I'm going to try to fix this now, I just hope that the problem doesn't run any deeper. This will be available in the next version.

Report message to a moderator

Sergeant Major

Re: HAM 4.0 Alpha Testing Thread[message #262470] Mon, 13 September 2010 20:40 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Goumindong is currently offline Goumindong

 
Messages:5
Registered:September 2010
Quote:

That's... weird. I think it's a combination of the enemy wearing armor, and CTH being used in determining damage, though I can't really explain that. Actually a savegame at that point would've really helped.


Should the system even be basing damage off of CTH values with the new CTH? Is the game still using the old method of determining damage (and if it is, how does that work with the new system)? Granted I am not testing at the moment (though would be happy to do so). But knowing how damage works would probably be pretty helpful (both in testing values and in possibly coming up with ways to make damage mimic the new CTH ideals more closely) to those who are.

Report message to a moderator

Private
Re: HAM 4.0 Alpha Testing Thread[message #262474] Mon, 13 September 2010 20:52 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Headrock

 
Messages:1760
Registered:March 2006
Location: Jerusalem
PACKAGE UPDATE

Version 4 is available at the same link as before.

Change Log v3 -> v4:
  • Fix: Guns with large magazines no longer fire all their bullets in autofire mode.
  • Fix: The Shot Offset message toggle works now.
  • Fix: The CTH indicator circles now draw more intelligently behind the other indicators.
  • Shift-click on the PREV or NEXT buttons in Bobby Ray's skips 5 pages forward/backward.
  • Aiming now relies (much) more on the Marksmanship skill than other skills:
    AIM_EXP increased from 1.0 to 2.0
    AIM_MARKS increased from 3.0 to 10.0
    AIM_DEX increased from 2.0 to 3.0
  • AIM_DRAW_COST increased from -1.5 to -2.0 to make heavier weapons even harder to aim without proper support.

Report message to a moderator

Sergeant Major

Re: HAM 4.0 Alpha Testing Thread[message #262479] Mon, 13 September 2010 22:47 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Headrock

 
Messages:1760
Registered:March 2006
Location: Jerusalem
As requested by Tais, I've added another functionality to BR's:

Shift-clicking any item in BR will add ALL available stock of that item to your purchase.
Shift-right-clicking a purchased item will un-buy all stock of that item.

This feature will be included in the next version.

Report message to a moderator

Sergeant Major

Re: HAM 4.0 Alpha Testing Thread[message #262480] Mon, 13 September 2010 23:06 Go to previous messageGo to next message
sorca_2 is currently offline sorca_2

 
Messages:202
Registered:September 2010
Location: California, USA
Hello Headrock, I've got two questions/suggestions related to your last improvements:

1) Is it possible to display a list of possible attachments for a weapon in the regular game the way it does in BR? I ask because I bought an FN F2000 from Tony, but none of the cool stuff I have attachs to it (and had I known that, I might have reconsidered). I also can't figure out which grenades attach to its integrated launcher, but that's a different problem.

2) Is it possible for an attachment to display what weapons can accept it? I know the list could be long, but I'm only talking about the more obscure items like the stocks, the Match Sights, Old Aimpoint, and the Grippod (not common stuff like lasers, scopes, or suppressors). I ask because I bought a Grippod thinking it was going to be the greatest attachment ever, only to find out that it doesn't attach to any of my weapons--including ones that accept bipods and/or foregrips. I had the same thing happen with folding and retractable stocks earlier in the game.

Thanks and great work!

[Updated on: Mon, 13 September 2010 23:07] by Moderator

Report message to a moderator

Sergeant 1st Class
Re: HAM 4.0 Alpha Testing Thread[message #262481] Mon, 13 September 2010 23:09 Go to previous messageGo to next message
ko5ma

 
Messages:35
Registered:January 2010
Location: Poland
Not really a bug, but strange behavior - IMP (90 MRK, expert sniper) shooting at a redshirt 2 tiles away, pretty much unable to hit... Quicksave on my Skydrive. Is it because of the corner? It's my usual defensive setup, in OCTH it was always a guaranteed interrupt+headshot...

@ Sorca - 1 is in game since NAS, just hover the mouse over an attachment slot. 2 would be way too long to list i think.

Report message to a moderator

Private 1st Class
Re: HAM 4.0 Alpha Testing Thread[message #262482] Mon, 13 September 2010 23:20 Go to previous messageGo to previous message
sorca_2 is currently offline sorca_2

 
Messages:202
Registered:September 2010
Location: California, USA
Thanks, ko5ma, I'll have to try that out. Also for #2 I'm only talking about the obscure attachments--I don't think the list of possible guns for the Old Aimpoint or Match Sights would be longer than the list of possible attachments for the M4, right? Anyway I'm going to keep quiet now because I just noticed Headrock's admonishment about not posting questions. :headbanger:

Report message to a moderator

Sergeant 1st Class
Previous Topic: WF6.06 Mod Part 2
Next Topic: New Starting Gear Interface
Goto Forum:
  


Current Time: Fri Mar 29 07:24:13 GMT+2 2024

Total time taken to generate the page: 0.02461 seconds