Home » MODDING HQ 1.13 » Flugente's Magika Workshop » New feature: Tripwire-triggered mines, directional mines (claymores), mines display, layered hierarc
Re: New feature: tripwire-triggered mines (claymore)[message #308541] Thu, 02 August 2012 22:01 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Flugente

 
Messages:3461
Registered:April 2009
Location: Germany
Gas puddles would require a lot of coding (and doesn't make much sense imho).

TNT does not take tripwire. That is intentional. Why should it blow up if you pull at it?

Claymore already has the -tag. They can already be activated by tripwire.


Re: New feature: tripwire-triggered mines (claymore)[message #308547] Fri, 03 August 2012 06:03 Go to previous messageGo to next message
leyon

 
Messages:95
Registered:February 2011
Ah, so this is for stuff that gets activated by 'pulling' something out i.e. mines and grenades only?

Well, at least I know what to do with my heaps of grenades now Razz
Re: New feature: tripwire-triggered mines (claymore)[message #308595] Fri, 03 August 2012 21:03 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Flugente

 
Messages:3461
Registered:April 2009
Location: Germany
Thats the idea behind it. An explosive can only be triggered if it has that tag. Thats exactly what the transformations do, grenade + tripwire = grenade that acts as a tripwire-activatable mine.


Re: New feature: tripwire-triggered mines (claymore)[message #308627] Sat, 04 August 2012 09:49 Go to previous messageGo to next message
leyon

 
Messages:95
Registered:February 2011
Dude. You need to see this!

http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/systems/munitions/images/pdm.gif

Edit: Also, change the Claymore to have 700 fragments like the real thing and watch the bodies hit the floor Razz

[Updated on: Sat, 04 August 2012 10:20] by Moderator

Re: New feature: tripwire-triggered mines (claymore)[message #308630] Sat, 04 August 2012 11:19 Go to previous messageGo to next message
DepressivesBrot

 
Messages:3804
Registered:July 2009
You realize none of the explosives have as many fragments as 'the real thing' because it would be plain over the top?


Re: New feature: tripwire-triggered mines (claymore)[message #308634] Sat, 04 August 2012 12:25 Go to previous messageGo to next message
leyon

 
Messages:95
Registered:February 2011
We could always reduce the damage Razz

I actually just tried a test run with 10 mercs standing in a pyramid shape from a Claymore, reduced the fragments to 10 dmg each from 22 dmg, and upped the fragments 10x from 70 to 700. It murders the first 3 mercs, damages maybe two at the edges. A repeat with no movement and it kills another 2-3 mercs.

It's good fun though.
Re: New feature: tripwire-triggered mines (claymore)[message #308635] Sat, 04 August 2012 13:34 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Flugente

 
Messages:3461
Registered:April 2009
Location: Germany
The current claymore has 70 fragments. Unless you increase the frag range to ridiculous, map clearing amounts, that is enough, at close range 700 fragments wouldn't hit more.

Also the game cannot handle more than 1000 bullets/fragments on screen at a time (I already increased that from 200). If you have 2 700-fragment explosions, it will just fire 1000 max.

At the current ranges, 70 fragments is fully enough. Just increase the damage to get the same effect as with lower damage and more fragments.


Re: New feature: tripwire-triggered mines (claymore)[message #308639] Sat, 04 August 2012 15:33 Go to previous messageGo to next message
leyon

 
Messages:95
Registered:February 2011
Yeah, you're right. All the fragments shred the first few unlucky bastards anyway, so it doesn't make that much of a difference.

Also, just wondering about the xmls - the vertical degree tag I assume places the mine at ground level, and at what incline to fire the fragments at, right? Reckon it'll be possible to do something like a Bouncing Betty 360-degree up-in-the-air type mine?
Re: New feature: tripwire-triggered mines (claymore)[message #308647] Sat, 04 August 2012 20:01 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Flugente

 
Messages:3461
Registered:April 2009
Location: Germany
The detonation occurs from height 1, which is about the height of a prone merc (its the same for all explosions). The vertical degree determines the angle in which fragments are fired - if its 90, fragements can fly 45 degree up and down. This means, for example, that a soldier standing right next to a claymore will not get any headshots from any fragments, as they hit his legs and chests, but a few tiles further he will.

Note that if you do not set the -tag in Items.xml, whatever horizontal or vertical degrees you set in Explosives.xml will not be used, the fragments will fly everywhere.

The direction the fragments fly is the direction your merc had when planting the explosive.

For an explosive to bounce into the air one would have to simply increase the height of the explosion, can easyily be done.


Re: New feature: tripwire-triggered mines (claymore)[message #308648] Sat, 04 August 2012 20:12 Go to previous messageGo to next message
leyon

 
Messages:95
Registered:February 2011
Awesome. Thanks for that, it'll be useful to know Smile

Edit: Didn't see anything that mentioned height in the Explosives.xml. I assume ubMag is it?

[Updated on: Sat, 04 August 2012 20:45] by Moderator

Re: New feature: tripwire-triggered mines (claymore)[message #308649] Sat, 04 August 2012 21:10 Go to previous messageGo to next message
DepressivesBrot

 
Messages:3804
Registered:July 2009
Flugente
For an explosive to bounce into the air one would have to simply increase the height of the explosion, can easyily be done.
I figure with the VOG25-P, the 20mm and 25mm rounds and the potential for new stuff, adding a tag for airburst or jumping should be worth it.


Re: New feature: tripwire-triggered mines (claymore)[message #308651] Sat, 04 August 2012 21:17 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Flugente

 
Messages:3461
Registered:April 2009
Location: Germany
Height isn't mentioned because such a tag does not exist. What I meant is that it would be easy to code Smile


Re: New feature: tripwire-triggered mines (claymore)[message #309161] Thu, 16 August 2012 16:05 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Istrebitel

 
Messages:222
Registered:December 2009
Location: Russia, Saint-Petersburg
Great idea, and great implementation. I'm loving the ability to disarm bombs remotely, and prime them without planting, but still, the traps are too weak (except the claymore of course, but it only works when enemy is coming from specified heading). Really, detonating a grenade somewhere near a well armored enemy (which they are if you need to use traps to handle them) isnt doing much damage. It is still easier to plant a remote controlled explosive and blow it up - more damage, more range, less hassle... Maybe some more powerful explosives are in order for the tripwire based activation?

Btw, how do i disarm the wire or the grenade i planted?

[Updated on: Thu, 16 August 2012 16:05] by Moderator

Re: New feature: tripwire-triggered mines (claymore)[message #309490] Sat, 25 August 2012 02:38 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Flugente

 
Messages:3461
Registered:April 2009
Location: Germany
Well, the grenades/mines have always been this weak, but you can boost them by increasing explosion damage in the ini.

I am not sure what would be new appropriate explosive items. However, you can put to use the piles of grenades the enemy leaves behind by making mines out of them.

Tripwire can be disarmed just like regular explosives,it might be a bit tougher. Best way is to use someone with good explosives skills obviously. Note that if keep a wirecutter in your hand, you will get a significant bonus to defusing anything tripwire-related.

Another way is to use the (reworked) metal detector. It detects mines from multiple tiles away (if you use the 'discover traps'-view), and automatically flags mines next to you. Note that for this you must keep it in your hands.


Re: New feature: tripwire-triggered mines (claymore)[message #309762] Sun, 02 September 2012 22:47 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Flugente

 
Messages:3461
Registered:April 2009
Location: Germany
Update: As of r5546, the internal flags for tripwire networks have been completely reworked. You shouldn't notice any difference though. The rework will allow us much more networks, and much more hierarchy levels, so it would be possible to have 8 different trap networks, with 8 hierarchy levels etc.. Not possible at the moment, because I hate reworking the appropriate dialogue boxes Smile

However, when switching to this revision, the currently planted tripwires will behave weird, as their network numbers will be mixed. This is expected, I'm just saying this to warn you.

Till now, defusing planted tripwire was rather uneasy. This was due to the fact that the 'trap detected' dialogue isn't called when standing next to a planted piece of wire (otherwise it would be almost impossible to make trap networks). A blue flag was required.

Not anymore! You can now defuse existing tripwire way easier:

Equip a wirecutter in your first hand. Then click on the tile where the wire is while in crouched position. A dialogue for defusing the wire will appear.

As the wirecutter also gives a significant bonus on defusing, I'd strongly advise having one ready on your sappers.

[Updated on: Sun, 02 September 2012 22:54] by Moderator



Re: New feature: tripwire-triggered mines (claymore)[message #309767] Sun, 02 September 2012 23:40 Go to previous messageGo to next message
JMich

 
Messages:569
Registered:January 2011
Location: Greece
Flugente
As the wirecutter also gives a significant bonus on defusing, I'd strongly advise having one ready on your sappers.
You do know that there is a tag available, right? Is it wirecutters only that should get that bonus, or any item (in hand) that has that tag, even if it's not a wirecutter?

P.S. get your ass back on irc, people complain that it's too quite without you Wink
Re: New feature: tripwire-triggered mines (claymore)[message #309768] Sun, 02 September 2012 23:49 Go to previous messageGo to next message
DepressivesBrot

 
Messages:3804
Registered:July 2009
Arguably, the KCB knife with it's wire cutter function, but to a much lesser degree. It's basically "some cutter is better than trying to chew the wire" in that regard.


Re: New feature: tripwire-triggered mines (claymore)[message #309770] Sun, 02 September 2012 23:59 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Flugente

 
Messages:3461
Registered:April 2009
Location: Germany
Atm its just any item with the wirecutter function.

Hey, I originally planned on taking a break anyway. Just did a few fixes today I deemed necessary... meh, If I come back, I'll start coding again... or worse, tell about what I plan next, even though I want to keep it a secret for once.

perhaps tomorrow Wink


Re: New feature: tripwire-triggered mines (claymore)[message #309784] Mon, 03 September 2012 22:55 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Maalstroom

 
Messages:344
Registered:December 2008
Location: en route to San Hermanos
Don't keep the secret! let us know! Smile)
Re: New feature: tripwire-triggered mines (claymore)[message #309788] Mon, 03 September 2012 23:33 Go to previous messageGo to next message
lockie

 
Messages:3901
Registered:February 2006
Location: Scotland
Leave well enough alone , so impatient these days.... Smile


Re: New feature: tripwire-triggered mines (claymore)[message #309820] Wed, 05 September 2012 01:37 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Slax

 
Messages:1448
Registered:July 2006
Location: People riding polar bears...
Hmm. Pain and painkillers, opiates?
More drugs for the druggies. Very Happy

Re: New feature: tripwire-triggered mines (claymore)[message #310170] Sat, 15 September 2012 04:39 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Flugente

 
Messages:3461
Registered:April 2009
Location: Germany
Update: As of r5565 and GameDir r1538, we can now place tripwire networks and directional explosives in the map editor. MapAction/ActionItems.ml contains loads of new action items that allow this.

http://i48.tinypic.com/f02p9z.jpg
Simply select the type of action item, and then place it, the name should make it pretty obvious as to what it does.

I am sure that certain mappers will finally be able to make the maps a bit harder, since this allows them to build the same network stuff the player can. Note that these wires will not be shown in the trap display views, as it is not the player that planted them.

I fixed the Action Items for this. Turns out, they were always broken. Since this game was released. However, this never came out, as a very nasty error only occurs if you use item numbers > 255, which apparently noone ever did.

For an explanation, I'll quote myself here from ItemTypes.cpp 1163 and 1375:

Quote:

// Flugente fix: there is a severe problem with Action items. The problem is that in the above switch statement, we use the default stuff for action items.
// If the action item is a bomb etc. (bActionValue = 3), we want to set the bomb item. But due to EXTREME RETARDEDNESS, the ugYucky-struct differs on variable positions.
// To be precise (see in ItemTypes.h: union OLD_OBJECTTYPE_101_UNION for reference), its
//
// ...
// INT8 bGunStatus; // status % of gun
// UINT8 ubGunAmmoType; // ammo type, as per weapons.h
// UINT8 ubGunShotsLeft; // duh, amount of ammo left
// UINT16 usGunAmmoItem; // the item # for the item table
// ...
//
// in the first struct, that is used for the default stuff, but
//
// ...
// INT8 bBombStatus; // % status
// INT8 bDetonatorType; // timed, remote, or pressure-activated
// UINT16 usBombItem; // the usItem of the bomb.
// union
// {
// ...
//
// in the struct that stores the bomb item.
// Now, if our action item has a Bombitem > 255, that value is read from UINT16 ubGunShotsLeft in OBJECT_GUN.
// In the OBJECTTYPE::data union, OBJECT_GUN and OBJECT_BOMBS_AND_OTHER both have the UINT16 that stores the usBombItem or ubGunShotsLeft at the same position. So until here it is ok...
// However, this value now gets written into ugYucky.ubGunShotsLeft - which is an UINT8 instead of UINT16. This means that any item number > 255 is cut down.
// This error seems to have always been here (13 years). It just never occured until now.
// An easy fix would be to just switch the positions of UINT8ubGunShotsLeft and UINT16 usGunAmmoItem. However we cannot do that, as that will affect every object read ever anywhere.
//
// For this reason, I now present you this filthy, ugly hack, specifically for action items handle bombs:


And so on. The thing is, if the person that designed a certain union had thought about it for a minute longer, and then simply simply switched the ordering of 2 godamn variables, the error (any item referenced in an action item is cut if above 255) would never have occured. Switching that now is unadvisable, as this thing is used basically everywhere in the code, and could break who-knows-what.

:digit: :maskedsniper: :compcuppa: :rifle:

So yeah, if anybody decides to go back in time 13 years and slap some developers, you have my gratitude.

[Updated on: Sat, 15 September 2012 04:41] by Moderator



Re: New feature: tripwire-triggered mines (claymore)[message #311628] Tue, 30 October 2012 00:06 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Flugente

 
Messages:3461
Registered:April 2009
Location: Germany
Update: As of r5656, we now have the following:

- new item flag NO_METAL_DETECTION (131072) makes mines and bombs undetectable via metal detector. Also works on action item bombs and mines. Sparing usage is advised.
- new item flag JUMP_GRENADE (262144) increases the explosion heigth of explosives, can be used to simulate bouncing grenades or jumping mines.

That covers the beforementioned airburst grenades, I think. :sign:

[Updated on: Tue, 30 October 2012 00:50] by Moderator



Re: New feature: tripwire-triggered mines (claymore)[message #311638] Tue, 30 October 2012 14:09 Go to previous messageGo to next message
smeagol

 
Messages:2739
Registered:June 2008
Location: Bremen, Germany
Nice!

Edit: Uhm... are those item flag ID's already used by signal shell and vox set?

[Updated on: Tue, 30 October 2012 18:21] by Moderator



Re: New feature: tripwire-triggered mines (claymore)[message #311691] Thu, 01 November 2012 16:14 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Flugente

 
Messages:3461
Registered:April 2009
Location: Germany
That happens when you work on separate branches I guess... as it'll be quite a lot of time till the vox operator traits finds its way into the trunk (if that is wanted anyway), the signal shell and vox set flags will be whatever will be free at that point.


Re: New feature: tripwire-triggered mines (claymore)[message #312470] Mon, 26 November 2012 00:08 Go to previous messageGo to next message
krux

 
Messages:62
Registered:June 2011
It isn't possible to add fragments to regular grenades right? Would be pretty neat IMO (though i realize that with the short throwing range you would have to set the frag range really low).
Re: New feature: tripwire-triggered mines (claymore)[message #312473] Mon, 26 November 2012 00:33 Go to previous messageGo to next message
DepressivesBrot

 
Messages:3804
Registered:July 2009
Sure it's possible. And you don't need to set the range particularly low, you just have to use fragmentation grenades (aka defensive grenades) correctly: with hard cover between you and the landing spot.


Re: New feature: tripwire-triggered mines (claymore)[message #312540] Tue, 27 November 2012 12:36 Go to previous messageGo to next message
krux

 
Messages:62
Registered:June 2011
Hmm, I filled in this in the Mk2 Grenade entry in Explosives.xml, but I saw no effect.. Do I need to set some parameter in Items.xml too? I looked at the claymore for reference but saw no tags that seemed relevant.

70 
0                 
10 
100
360 
60
Re: New feature: tripwire-triggered mines (claymore)[message #312561] Tue, 27 November 2012 20:28 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Flugente

 
Messages:3461
Registered:April 2009
Location: Germany
I filled in the exact values you posted, and it works exactly like it should. Perhaps you filled in the wrong entry or use an outdated exe?


Re: New feature: tripwire-triggered mines (claymore)[message #312569] Wed, 28 November 2012 00:49 Go to previous messageGo to next message
krux

 
Messages:62
Registered:June 2011
Edited post so it's less confusing:

Ok, this is somewhat weird.. In the sector where I tested the XML tweaks the feature just doesn't work (claymores too). In all other sectors fragments works fine (claymores and modded grenades), but never in this one sector. I tested it in about 5 other sectors close by, and in a new game. Same problem. I use DepressivesBrot's 5693 SCI with AR maps pasted into the DATA folder, and the sector in question is D13.

[Updated on: Thu, 29 November 2012 13:23] by Moderator

Re: New feature: tripwire-triggered mines (claymore)[message #312755] Tue, 04 December 2012 12:07 Go to previous messageGo to next message
krux

 
Messages:62
Registered:June 2011
I encountered a few more sectors where fragments didn't work. One would guess that this feature would have nothing to do with leveldata. Is there anything that ties the fragment feature to specific maps, or some feature/tag/tileset that has to be activated on a map to make it work? I use AR maps as mentioned, so that could be why it doesn't work if that's the case.
Re: New feature: tripwire-triggered mines (claymore)[message #312773] Tue, 04 December 2012 21:40 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Flugente

 
Messages:3461
Registered:April 2009
Location: Germany
I've tested this, and its a funny error. In AR's D13 there are upper and lower cliffs. I do not know why, but fragments work correctly on the lower level in the south (which you cannot access by normal means). I suspect that when they build this map,height levels got somehow mixed up. As a result, the explosion spawns the fragments correctly. But they fly, well, 10 feet below. This is a map issue. Perhaps JAsmine and Beka have more insight?


Re: New feature: tripwire-triggered mines (claymore)[message #313906] Sat, 05 January 2013 03:15 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Vince7403

 
Messages:146
Registered:February 2012
Is that 214 million trap components in the entire game, or per sector?
Re: New feature: tripwire-triggered mines (claymore)[message #313917] Sat, 05 January 2013 16:54 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Flugente

 
Messages:3461
Registered:April 2009
Location: Germany
Its 2.14 billion possible traps per sector. If I recall correctly, thats the maximum amount of objects any sector can have.

Savegames might be a bit big, though.


Re: New feature: tripwire-triggered mines (claymore)[message #314117] Thu, 10 January 2013 22:49 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Vince7403

 
Messages:146
Registered:February 2012
Now if we only had some way of making self-resetting traps, we might be able to implement a primitive computer inside JA2...
Re: New feature: tripwire-triggered mines (claymore)[message #314196] Sat, 12 January 2013 23:51 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Flugente

 
Messages:3461
Registered:April 2009
Location: Germany
That isn't hard to do, though I fail to see the advantage Wink


Re: New feature: tripwire-triggered mines (claymore)[message #325934] Sun, 29 September 2013 20:54 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Flugente

 
Messages:3461
Registered:April 2009
Location: Germany
As of r6455 and GameDir r1797, there is a new item: tripwire roll (Item #1640). When attempting to plant this, the game will instead plant standard tripwire - you 'roll off' wire of the 'roll'. A roll has 100 triwpire pieces (1 per % status).

These can later be merged onto the roll again, and merging 2 will create a new roll. This will make placing tripwire much easier, as you won't have to constantly put new ones in your hands.

The pic currently used is a placeholder, a new pic would be good.


Re: New feature: tripwire-triggered mines (claymore)[message #325938] Sun, 29 September 2013 22:14 Go to previous messageGo to next message
sevenfm

 
Messages:1918
Registered:December 2012
Location: Soviet Russia
Flugente
Good thing, very useful for Kaboooom'ers!
Barry thank you!


Re: New feature: tripwire-triggered mines (claymore)[message #325944] Mon, 30 September 2013 01:41 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Zombiehunter

 
Messages:185
Registered:March 2011
Location: Franconia, Germany
Nice work Flug, the amount of work you put into JA2 still amazes me Wink

This will be biiiig fun in tixa bwahahaha :crossbones:

[Updated on: Mon, 30 September 2013 02:09] by Moderator

Re: New feature: tripwire-triggered mines (claymore)[message #325984] Mon, 30 September 2013 19:59 Go to previous messageGo to previous message
sevenfm

 
Messages:1918
Registered:December 2012
Location: Soviet Russia
Does anyone know how to use new tag from r6455?
What the "Connection specifics" means and how it can be used?


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