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Placing Sandbags[message #223872] Sun, 28 June 2009 00:28 Go to next message
Off_Topic

 
Messages:1038
Registered:January 2009
A great defensive feature of Night Ops, the ability to place Sandbags where you want them. Try not to lock Militia in or place taller Sand Bags around them, the AI can't handle it very well.

Here's how to do it:

1. You can only place Sand Bags in Sectors where you have trained Militia.

http://i657.photobucket.com/albums/uu293/off_topic/Sand1.jpg

2. To place small Sand Bags facing North/South Press "[", to place taller Sand Bags, hold "Alt" & Press "[".

http://i657.photobucket.com/albums/uu293/off_topic/Sand2.jpg

3. Same goes for East/West facing Sand Bags except this time Press "]".

http://i657.photobucket.com/albums/uu293/off_topic/Sand3.jpg

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Re: Placing Sandbags[message #223873] Sun, 28 June 2009 00:33 Go to previous messageGo to next message
gmonk

 
Messages:647
Registered:April 2002
Location: Newfoundland, Canada
 I could see a "Zulu" type mod using this feature... Smile

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Re: Placing Sandbags[message #223889] Sun, 28 June 2009 02:26 Go to previous messageGo to next message
coffeecommander

 
Messages:88
Registered:June 2009
Location: Europe, and pitying you.
I can see sectors stuffed with sandbags till there's no ground left to walk on.

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Re: Placing Sandbags[message #223898] Sun, 28 June 2009 03:02 Go to previous messageGo to next message
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Messages:1038
Registered:January 2009
caf
I can see sectors stuffed with sandbags till there's no ground left to walk on.


Not possible, there's a limit, look at the last Screen Shot (On the left). Depends on how may Militia you have.

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Re: Placing Sandbags[message #223899] Sun, 28 June 2009 03:03 Go to previous messageGo to next message
coffeecommander

 
Messages:88
Registered:June 2009
Location: Europe, and pitying you.
I have 64 per sector Very Happy

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Re: Placing Sandbags[message #223901] Sun, 28 June 2009 03:06 Go to previous messageGo to next message
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Messages:1038
Registered:January 2009
Using all the SBs from the three sectors though?

***

Just remembered, you should be careful with how you place them, otherwise they end up with "holes".

[Updated on: Sun, 28 June 2009 03:08] by Moderator

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Re: Placing Sandbags[message #223909] Sun, 28 June 2009 03:30 Go to previous messageGo to next message
coffeecommander

 
Messages:88
Registered:June 2009
Location: Europe, and pitying you.
Nah. 64 per sector...though I think I'll reduce it to 32 since I can't remember how it made sense to me to have more guys in there than can be on the map at the same time.

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Re: Placing Sandbags[message #223922] Sun, 28 June 2009 05:35 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Thor

 
Messages:432
Registered:February 2007
Location: Belgium
 At last... now it's possible... !!!

Another revolution!!

It's fantastic, although I think it should also be possible elsewhere. As mercs have to make these fortications themselves then, they should also:

- have a shovel
- lose a lot of energy (e.g. 50 points, while only possible when having a certain amount of energy like min. 75 points)
- lose morale
- have a chance to gain strength/health

The amount of possible sandbags could be 2x the amount of mercs in that sector.
So with 2 mercs you would have a max of 4 tiles with sandbags, with 6 mercs that would make 12, etc.

One more thing. You should also have the possibility to remove them when you placed a wrong one, for instance.

This way you could create your base anywhere you like. Can't wait until this feature will be implemented in v1.13. Seems like Night Ops has many brilliant features for v.1.13. Smile

Hey Headrock, something for HAM perhaps? Wink

[Updated on: Sun, 28 June 2009 05:49] by Moderator

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Re: Placing Sandbags[message #223932] Sun, 28 June 2009 09:46 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Logisteric

 
Messages:3395
Registered:December 2008
Location: B
 Thor
One more thing. You should also have the possibility to remove them when you placed a wrong one, for instance.

tnt?

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Re: Placing Sandbags[message #223940] Sun, 28 June 2009 11:59 Go to previous messageGo to next message
lockie

 
Messages:3930
Registered:February 2006
Location: Scotland
 Haven't done this yet myself , but isn't there also a time limit from alarm till attack ?

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Re: Placing Sandbags[message #223972] Sun, 28 June 2009 14:41 Go to previous messageGo to next message
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Messages:1038
Registered:January 2009

Thor
One more thing. You should also have the possibility to remove them when you placed a wrong one, for instance.


Just cycle over them until it goes blank to remove them.

lockie
Haven't done this yet myself , but isn't there also a time limit from alarm till attack ?


You can place them anytime, not just for the Air Assaults, you just have less time if you aren't already prepared.

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Re: Placing Sandbags[message #224018] Sun, 28 June 2009 23:05 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Thor

 
Messages:432
Registered:February 2007
Location: Belgium
 As in reality it takes a while, I think it should only be possible to place them when there are no enemies in the sector. There may be better ideas, of course.

Same goes for trenches which according to Shanga are manageable as well... In contrast to sandbags they should not be destroyable by explosives... especially not the walls they consist of.

But let's now focus on sandbags... one thing at a time, I guess Wink

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Re: Placing Sandbags[message #224045] Mon, 29 June 2009 01:09 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Shanga

 
Messages:3523
Registered:January 2000
Location: Danubia
 Well trenches are manageable in the sense that mappers can build them out of a special tileset. The coolest thing would be to use the tweak further the sandbag code and...

a) add empty bags to the gameworld + shovel
b) a pickaxe to dig trenches

Basically as I've already said trenches are a visual illusion consisting of an invisible wall in front of your mercs and a ground tile that looks like earth was digged up. When you are crouched/prone in the trench you are protected by the invisible wall and it looks like you're actually protected by your body being below ground.

Imho there should be two types of trenches. Already built defences with large trenches and small foxholes a merc can dig with a shovel and offer limited protection (smaller wall that only protects when prone). Would be unrealistic that in a day you could build Maginot line with a shovel and a pick.

[Updated on: Mon, 29 June 2009 01:09] by Moderator

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Re: Placing Sandbags[message #224046] Mon, 29 June 2009 01:12 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Logisteric

 
Messages:3395
Registered:December 2008
Location: B
 Shanga
Would be unrealistic that in a day you could build Maginot line with a shovel and a pick.


very unrealistic, and btw who wants to have one of those? you know what happened to the last one - even on ebay nobody would buy it.

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Re: Placing Sandbags[message #224048] Mon, 29 June 2009 01:18 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Gorro der Grüne

 
Messages:1542
Registered:March 2009
Location: Broadwurschd-City
 Trenches should be zickzack, otherwise you shoot a Milan from one end to the other (Goose Green!!!).
(2 men dead at the end - 100 burning)


Maginot Line: This was nuts - it proofed as (in)effective as Polish cavalry 'gainst German armour

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Re: Placing Sandbags[message #226111] Tue, 07 July 2009 22:17 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Thor

 
Messages:432
Registered:February 2007
Location: Belgium
 Sidenote for implementation:


I have to press "

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Re: Placing Sandbags[message #226114] Tue, 07 July 2009 22:32 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Mauser

 
Messages:781
Registered:August 2006
Location: Bavaria - Germany
 funnily enough i was only able to place sandbags in two sectors so far. allthough i have fully trained militia, i cannot place sandbags anymore for some reason.

no matter what i do, no sandbags are placed anymore. is there a total limit of how many sandbags you can place on all maps or does every map has it

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☆★GL★☆
Re: Placing Sandbags[message #226116] Tue, 07 July 2009 22:37 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Thor

 
Messages:432
Registered:February 2007
Location: Belgium
 I only had 15 militia and could place 4 bags...

Maybe it is per town (as you can redistribute militia in a town as well)??

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Re: Placing Sandbags[message #226129] Tue, 07 July 2009 23:44 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Shanga

 
Messages:3523
Registered:January 2000
Location: Danubia
 Yes, militia are the one "filling" the bags with sand so the number of sandbags you can build and the speed at which they are filled depends on the number of militiamen present. Good news, but unconfirmed, is that deleted sandbags are placed into "storage" not lost, so if you decide to modify your fortifications you might have an easier time.

[Updated on: Tue, 07 July 2009 23:45] by Moderator

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Re: Placing Sandbags[message #226139] Wed, 08 July 2009 00:33 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Thor

 
Messages:432
Registered:February 2007
Location: Belgium
 Damn, after a few days with those 15 militia I was able to place 51 sandbags... and counting????

Is there a limit?

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Re: Placing Sandbags[message #226142] Wed, 08 July 2009 00:47 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Shanga

 
Messages:3523
Registered:January 2000
Location: Danubia
 When you get hate mails from seaside hotel owners i think it's about time you should stop. Very Happy

On second thought, you found out a thing militia is actually good for and you want to spoil the miracle? Shame on you...

[Updated on: Wed, 08 July 2009 00:48] by Moderator

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Re: Placing Sandbags[message #226150] Wed, 08 July 2009 01:05 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Thor

 
Messages:432
Registered:February 2007
Location: Belgium
 Hehe. But I wouldn't mind a limit. Although it's handy as it is. Now I place sandbags around walls to prevent enemies from climbing roofs and attack me from the back... Too bad we can't place sandbags on roofs like they often do in Night Ops... Like that feature too !!

If we could place 'em there, we could deal with several Drassen battles...

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Re: Placing Sandbags[message #226153] Wed, 08 July 2009 01:17 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Logisteric

 
Messages:3395
Registered:December 2008
Location: B
 too bad, it should be as in reality - opforce being faster on your roof via your sandbags, and thus sparing aps for your mercs, that is Mad

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Re: Placing Sandbags[message #226217] Wed, 08 July 2009 09:59 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Thor

 
Messages:432
Registered:February 2007
Location: Belgium
 Okay, but in real life you could find another way to make enemies unable to climb the roof, so I don't see it as cheating. Smile

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Re: Placing Sandbags[message #226221] Wed, 08 July 2009 10:32 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Logisteric

 
Messages:3395
Registered:December 2008
Location: B
 so why not having sandbags and barbed wire

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Re: Placing Sandbags[message #226226] Wed, 08 July 2009 10:53 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Thor

 
Messages:432
Registered:February 2007
Location: Belgium
 Ha, because there isn't available in JA2 NO. Would be nice if it was, though.

[Updated on: Wed, 08 July 2009 10:54] by Moderator

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Re: Placing Sandbags[message #226227] Wed, 08 July 2009 11:01 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Thor

 
Messages:432
Registered:February 2007
Location: Belgium
 Quote:
Just remembered, you should be careful with how you place them, otherwise they end up with "holes".


Is it even possible to make corners so that there aren't any holes? Or do you need a double line for that?

If we are going to implement sandbags, we will also have to make sure that they really fit together without the holes... Better make it good from the start. Are you that far with your JSD knowledge, Shanga? JSDs should be improved anyway it seems.

As sandbags should become more efficient...

Did a test with two mercs prone behind them shooting bursts at each other... (large and small sandbags).
They kept shooting right through them. Even with two rows of big sandbags the result is nearly the same, so watch out when using them Sad

Try it out yourself if you find some extra ammo..

[Updated on: Sun, 21 July 2013 15:34] by Moderator

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Re: Placing Sandbags[message #323026] Sun, 21 July 2013 15:35 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Thor

 
Messages:432
Registered:February 2007
Location: Belgium
 How come that in this mod it is possible to use sandbags in sectors where there aren't any already? Anything useful?

[Updated on: Sun, 21 July 2013 15:43] by Moderator

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Re: Placing Sandbags[message #323032] Sun, 21 July 2013 18:50 Go to previous messageGo to next message
DepressivesBrot

 
Messages:3813
Registered:July 2009
There don't have to be sandbags, just the possibility. I'll assume that NOps uses heavily modified tilesets to achieve this. Just like AIMNAS.

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Re: Placing Sandbags[message #323034] Sun, 21 July 2013 19:20 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Thor

 
Messages:432
Registered:February 2007
Location: Belgium
 Ha, okay, so at least they are in every separate tileset then.. Okay, then it's not very useful. Thought it would in some way spawn a particular sandbag by referring to a tilest or something in the code...

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Re: Placing Sandbags[message #325682] Wed, 25 September 2013 17:49 Go to previous messageGo to next message
viracicha

 
Messages:103
Registered:November 2007
i m playing on the 6279 version and triying to use empty sandbag.

when i put them in the merc hand a picaxe appear. does i need a shovel to fill them ?

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Re: Placing Sandbags[message #325683] Wed, 25 September 2013 17:51 Go to previous messageGo to next message
DepressivesBrot

 
Messages:3813
Registered:July 2009
yes

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Re: Placing Sandbags[message #327336] Wed, 30 October 2013 13:32 Go to previous message
viracicha

 
Messages:103
Registered:November 2007
THX

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