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Re: Beta-Testers for new 1.13 Features[message #253693] Fri, 11 June 2010 15:56 Go to previous messageGo to next message
RoWa21

 
Messages:2047
Registered:October 2005
Location: Austria
PVal
May I test it with Wildfire, (the maps only, not the whole mod)?

sure


Re: Beta-Testers for new 1.13 Features[message #254181] Thu, 17 June 2010 21:06 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Airbus
Messages:5
Registered:June 2010
Location: Russia, Moscow

Hello, may I help in testing? =)
Re: Beta-Testers for new 1.13 Features[message #254182] Thu, 17 June 2010 21:11 Go to previous messageGo to next message
RoWa21

 
Messages:2047
Registered:October 2005
Location: Austria
Sure. I send you a PM.


Re: Beta-Testers for new 1.13 Features[message #254345] Sun, 20 June 2010 00:40 Go to previous messageGo to next message
P.Val

 
Messages:80
Registered:May 2010
Wow, this bugzilla is quite hard to use, I've seen much better organized configurations.. sometimes it's not that clear what is assigned by who and to who.

Anyway, I had to turn off the SHOW_TACTICAL_FACE_GEAR as it causes CTD in some cases (like Biggins equipping a gas mask)
Re: Beta-Testers for new 1.13 Features[message #254403] Sun, 20 June 2010 23:46 Go to previous messageGo to next message
RoWa21

 
Messages:2047
Registered:October 2005
Location: Austria
PVal
Wow, this bugzilla is quite hard to use, I've seen much better organized configurations.. sometimes it's not that clear what is assigned by who and to who.


It does not matter to whom (which developer) the bug is assigned. Any coder can pick a bug and try to fix it. But please make a comment in the bug description if you want to take that bug for fixing.


Re: Beta-Testers for new 1.13 Features[message #254808] Fri, 25 June 2010 00:27 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Ishbane

 
Messages:11
Registered:August 2006
Location: Germany
How is progress in the beta, will it be finished anytime soon?
I'm dying to start a new game, but'd hate to miss out on the new features.

I'll volunteer for testing, if it is somewhat stable.
Re: Beta-Testers for new 1.13 Features[message #254843] Fri, 25 June 2010 12:55 Go to previous messageGo to next message
RoWa21

 
Messages:2047
Registered:October 2005
Location: Austria
@ishbane: Send me a PM if you like to join the beta test. Beta test will end at the end of July. The we start fixing bugs and present another version for testing.


Re: Beta-Testers for new 1.13 Features[message #255678] Thu, 08 July 2010 02:12 Go to previous messageGo to next message
SharkD

 
Messages:362
Registered:July 2003
This is a good idea. However, it would be neat if you could a splash screen to list what changes we should be looking for so that we don't have to track down some web page or document somewhere. Documents get moved or disappear, or say stuff that is no longer current with the version we're experimenting with.
Re: Beta-Testers for new 1.13 Features[message #257586] Mon, 26 July 2010 20:45 Go to previous messageGo to next message
silversurfer

 
Messages:2156
Registered:May 2009
What about the new civ###.edt files? When I talk to some of the NPCs now I only get "quote 7", "quote 1", "quote 6" ... as an answer.

Re: Beta-Testers for new 1.13 Features[message #257592] Mon, 26 July 2010 21:41 Go to previous messageGo to next message
RoWa21

 
Messages:2047
Registered:October 2005
Location: Austria
silversurfer
What about the new civ###.edt files? When I talk to some of the NPCs now I only get "quote 7", "quote 1", "quote 6" ... as an answer.


These files are a feature from Jazz's Legion 2 and the "quote 7", "quote 1" are defined in the "CIV".edt files. I have written Jazz a mail that he should explain what's the purpose of those EDT files. I hope he will reply soon.

Try to remove those CIV*.edt files and you should have normal behavior for now.

EDIT: I have added a readme file and a screenshot from the map editor which uses the new civ files. Just upadte from SVN development trunk and you should have the 2 new files in the GameDir\Docs folder. It should explain the purpose of the files.

[Updated on: Mon, 26 July 2010 22:02] by Moderator



Re: Beta-Testers for new 1.13 Features[message #257596] Mon, 26 July 2010 22:20 Go to previous messageGo to next message
RoWa21

 
Messages:2047
Registered:October 2005
Location: Austria
@all: I think I have fixed the bug that civilians to do not talk anymore with the player.


Re: Beta-Testers for new 1.13 Features[message #257598] Mon, 26 July 2010 22:26 Go to previous messageGo to next message
P.Val

 
Messages:80
Registered:May 2010
When is the testing part officially closed? Was it the end of this month? I had some spare time and did a nearly full playthrough and gathered more than a dozen bugs (well, most of them just minor annoyances, not critical bugs), neatly arranged in savegames, but did not find the time and patience to organize and upload them. I hope I'll do it this week.
Re: Beta-Testers for new 1.13 Features[message #257599] Mon, 26 July 2010 22:38 Go to previous messageGo to next message
RoWa21

 
Messages:2047
Registered:October 2005
Location: Austria
PVal
When is the testing part officially closed? Was it the end of this month? I had some spare time and did a nearly full playthrough and gathered more than a dozen bugs (well, most of them just minor annoyances, not critical bugs), neatly arranged in savegames, but did not find the time and patience to organize and upload them. I hope I'll do it this week.


Thats cool. I will wait till you have uploaded the bugs to bugzilla. Write me a PM when its done. I hope you find time and patience in the new few days Smile


Re: Beta-Testers for new 1.13 Features[message #257612] Tue, 27 July 2010 01:11 Go to previous messageGo to next message
silversurfer

 
Messages:2156
Registered:May 2009
I removed the civ###.edt files only to find out that the same civilian doesn't talk to me anymore. Very Happy
Well, its only logical because the game doesn't find his quote file anymore.

After putting them back in he said his "quote #" again. I know that this text is the content of the EDTs. I was just wondering if they should contain something useful.

I can put something stupid in there just for fun. Wink

Re: Beta-Testers for new 1.13 Features[message #257820] Thu, 29 July 2010 00:02 Go to previous messageGo to next message
P.Val

 
Messages:80
Registered:May 2010
I went through my savegames archive for bugs in this beta. After looking through two folders of saves and testing them again, some of them no longer behave like bugs (like a save a few seconds before a CTD no longer produces a CTD), and most of the rest are just minor annoyances. Anyway, to not make the bugzilla more crowded with possibly useless reports (and because uploading files fails very often for me), I post all of them here in a list, and please just answer with the number of those which I should upload.

I played it with full HAM, and Wildfire maps.

pack1:
01: 9 AP to shoot? An M16 with a cost of 19 AP gets just 9 with a merc of level 5, while fighting against bloodcats. I did'nt see that happening in any other situation.
03: practically zero CTH shown as high: Seems to be a problem with calculating cover: CTH is shown as over 50%, I played this savegame several times for several turns, without scoring any hits, but the CTH for the 2 mercs aiming at stationary enemy was always above 50%, sometimes over 80%.
04: Two simultaneous AI attacks: Deidranna's soldiers attacked a town with only militia guarding it, two sectors at the same time. One was autoresolved, but in the other the militia and enemy are both present, with no possibility to resolve the battle, other than going there personally with mercs. Basically, if two AI battles happen at the same time, only one gets autoresolved.
05: Schr
Re: Beta-Testers for new 1.13 Features[message #257826] Thu, 29 July 2010 01:13 Go to previous messageGo to next message
RoWa21

 
Messages:2047
Registered:October 2005
Location: Austria
@PVal: I have send you a PM -> I want them ALL Smile

@15: When does that happen. Do you have a savegame right before that?
@16: Should be fixed.
@Other1: Should be fixed.
@Other2: Jump through window uses the normal jump over fence animation. Problems could happen cause of the animation.

BTW, nice catch on the bugs.


Re: Beta-Testers for new 1.13 Features[message #257829] Thu, 29 July 2010 01:58 Go to previous messageGo to next message
P.Val

 
Messages:80
Registered:May 2010
Pack2_15: I have only a save from after it, I detected it only accidentally: after the battle the progress was 65/83. What happened before, is that I solved the crepitus quest. What I can know for sure, that the progress right before killing the monster queen was 58, killing it gives 74/58 (does it mean it will decay back to 58 if nothing happens?). Then I went to capture the SAM site, with nothing significant inbetween. (just ordering stuff from BR, waiting, training, etc.)

Other2: Jumping over fence does not require an extra tile between you and the fence if jumping from NE to SW. The window, however, does.
Re: Beta-Testers for new 1.13 Features[message #257963] Fri, 30 July 2010 21:32 Go to previous messageGo to next message
silversurfer

 
Messages:2156
Registered:May 2009
Pack2-15: I tried to reproduce it but capturing Cambria SAM always got me +1 to game progress. On my tests it went from 17/0 to 18/0 or from 17/17 to 18/17 depending on if the max progress counter was already updated.
Max progress is only updated once in a while.

Pack2-8: A savegame from Tixa start would be nice. In the one on JaggZilla Shank is already hostile and I couldn't find a cause for this. I started another game to reproduce it. I shot one of Wardens guards - nothing, shot Dynamo - Shank didn't care. He remained neutral all the time.


What about the civilians saying "quote 1" and so on? It's clear that this text comes from the civ###.edt. But some of the civilians still say their old text. Where do those other civilians come from? The maps existed before this new feature so nobody could have placed those civilians there. How comes that some of them use the new quote files?


Ok, looking at the next bug...


edit: Pack2-4 Rescuing Joe gave me an increase in loyalty of 11 percent in Cambria (from 27 to 38). Do you have a savegame from before you bring that little brat back home?

I hope we're not chasing ghost bugs here from some very old version...

edit2: Wait a minute! Did you kill any of the civilian guards like the one in Drassen mine (Pack2-12)? I think that he belongs to "UNNAMED_CIV_GROUP_19", just like Dynamo and Shank... When I use that savegame and teleport to Tixa, Dynamo is already hostile before I do anything.

[Updated on: Fri, 30 July 2010 22:41] by Moderator


Re: Beta-Testers for new 1.13 Features[message #257971] Fri, 30 July 2010 22:49 Go to previous messageGo to next message
P.Val

 
Messages:80
Registered:May 2010
As I said they are mostly observations, not necessarily bugs.

Pack2-15: maybe it has to do something with the creatures quest? I captured the SAM shortly after dealing with the monsters.
Pack2-8: I have a savegame only before attacking Tixa and one after entering the basement level. I'll try to load the closest save before it and capture Tixa again. Can't promise to do today or tomorrow.
I suspect the civilian "guards" in Wildfire maps might have to do something with it.
Pack2-4: I have a save with Joey in the squad, 2 sectors away from Cambria, loyalty of 77. Tried it out now, brought him to his mother, had the dialog, loyalty still 77.
Re: Beta-Testers for new 1.13 Features[message #257973] Fri, 30 July 2010 23:10 Go to previous messageGo to next message
silversurfer

 
Messages:2156
Registered:May 2009
Pack2-8: I don't think that another save would help because the one from 2-12 (JaggZilla Bug #265) is before you attacked Tixa and there Dynamo is already hostile. The question is when did you make "UNNAMED_CIV_GROUP_19" angry? Must have happened long before Tixa.

Pack2-4 Maybe you only gain loyalty below a certain level? Could you please upload that savegame to JaggZilla?

Re: Beta-Testers for new 1.13 Features[message #257974] Fri, 30 July 2010 23:32 Go to previous messageGo to next message
P.Val

 
Messages:80
Registered:May 2010
Hm... the only other part when a group of civilians became hostile was at the Drassen mine. I never attacked them, but if I visited the sector at night, the "guards" in the guard shacks around the mine attacked me.

edit: had a save with Joey in the squad, a few sectors away from Cambria. Went to Cambria just to have a better save to upload, and... the loyalty changes from 77 to 88. I suspect it was my mistake, and bringing Joey to his mom and having the quest solved in the history log is not the event which increases to loyalty, but talking with his mother does. So the bug is either no longer valid, or it should be renamed to "quest set to accomplished in the history, but still need to talk to an npc to have its effects". Maybe pointless as the quest system should be externalized anyway...
Should I update/remove the bug from bugzilla?

[Updated on: Fri, 30 July 2010 23:47] by Moderator

Re: Beta-Testers for new 1.13 Features[message #257987] Sat, 31 July 2010 03:01 Go to previous messageGo to next message
silversurfer

 
Messages:2156
Registered:May 2009
PVal
Hm... the only other part when a group of civilians became hostile was at the Drassen mine. I never attacked them, but if I visited the sector at night, the "guards" in the guard shacks around the mine attacked me.


Didn't ever notice that and I was there at night too. Strange thing indeed. Btw I used you savegame from the "prone" issue to check Dynamo. That was when you attacked Drassen C13. I finished the battle and teleported to Tixa. At this stage in the game he wasn't hostile.
Admit it! You went berserk on some civilians because they are always standing in the way. Wink Razz


PVal

edit: had a save with Joey in the squad, a few sectors away from Cambria. Went to Cambria just to have a better save to upload, and... the loyalty changes from 77 to 88. I suspect it was my mistake, and bringing Joey to his mom and having the quest solved in the history log is not the event which increases to loyalty, but talking with his mother does. So the bug is either no longer valid, or it should be renamed to "quest set to accomplished in the history, but still need to talk to an npc to have its effects". Maybe pointless as the quest system should be externalized anyway...
Should I update/remove the bug from bugzilla?


Ah, now I know how that happened and I could reproduce it! You came back to Cambria with your squad including Joe. You sent Joe to his mother - alone. This way he talks to his mother and the rest of the conversation is not triggered because there is no merc near to her to whom she could talk to. That is why you didn't get an increase in loyalty. If you would have sent a merc together with Joe the full conversation would have been triggered automatically. It's not a bug - it's a feature. Very Happy
Please update the record on JaggZilla and close the bug.

Re: Beta-Testers for new 1.13 Features[message #258006] Sat, 31 July 2010 11:53 Go to previous messageGo to next message
silversurfer

 
Messages:2156
Registered:May 2009
myself

What about the civilians saying "quote 1" and so on? It's clear that this text comes from the civ###.edt. But some of the civilians still say their old text. Where do those other civilians come from? The maps existed before this new feature so nobody could have placed those civilians there. How comes that some of them use the new quote files?



I just checked the map again and found out that this civilian belongs to faction "UNNAMED_CIV_GROUP_15". He's on WF map C6 in the northern store between Angels' and the warehouse.

Re: Beta-Testers for new 1.13 Features[message #258052] Sat, 31 July 2010 22:17 Go to previous messageGo to next message
P.Val

 
Messages:80
Registered:May 2010
silversurfer: I never attacked any civilians, or at least none that I know of. Stray bullets and bleeding to death, or stray explosions, maybe? Anyways, if this effects the hostility of Dynamo and Shank, it's a bug by itself.

About the other one, I closed it. I don't think we can consider it as a feature, as the "quest accomplished" showing up in the history can be misleading.
Re: Beta-Testers for new 1.13 Features[message #258058] Sun, 01 August 2010 01:06 Go to previous messageGo to next message
silversurfer

 
Messages:2156
Registered:May 2009
PVal
silversurfer: I never attacked any civilians, or at least none that I know of. Stray bullets and bleeding to death, or stray explosions, maybe? Anyways, if this effects the hostility of Dynamo and Shank, it's a bug by itself.


Probably only happens on WF maps. On WF maps there are more civilians and some of them belong to groups which were not used before on vanilla maps. Maybe you hurt/killed someone in another sector which was a member of the same faction Dynamo and Shank belong to. Usually civilians belong to group "NON_CIV_GROUP" which is group "NONE" in the editor. The question is why are some of them in a different group? I will ask smeagol if he can explain that to me.


PVal

About the other one, I closed it. I don't think we can consider it as a feature, as the "quest accomplished" showing up in the history can be misleading.


Yeah, it's a design problem but that probably existed in vanilla Ja2 as well. You made sure that Joey is back home safely, right? So - quest accomplished. You could say that Joey made it back on his own because you didn't bring him back personally. So why should loyalty increase? The problem that I see there is the text that he says to his mother. He says something like "I got lost and then they found me.". Who are they? Your mercs are not next to him so who is he talking about? I don't know what he says in the english version as I only have the german one. Does he say something different in English?

Anyway, it could probably be changed so that you get the loyalty increase when Joey is back home no matter what.


Re: Beta-Testers for new 1.13 Features[message #258061] Sun, 01 August 2010 02:24 Go to previous messageGo to next message
P.Val

 
Messages:80
Registered:May 2010
suddenly another bug jumped to my mind, but I have no proof for it and could not reproduce it: the game crashes when a civilian steps on a mine in battle. It happened where I placed some mines close to the edge of the map in anticipation of an enemy attack. A civilian happened to step on one of them, and the game crashed. I had a quicksave in the previous turn, and retried it a lot of times, but the civilians decided to run in other directions, not stepping on the mine. I tried it out recently, by placing mines around civilians, but the only result was the militia attacking me. Maybe it does matter if it was in a battle? Or on other factors?
Re: Beta-Testers for new 1.13 Features[message #258086] Sun, 01 August 2010 15:47 Go to previous messageGo to next message
silversurfer

 
Messages:2156
Registered:May 2009
I investigated the "Shank becomes hostile" story a little more and now I know what's going on.

In the old code versions there were 20 factions defined:

Number		Name in game			Name in Editor

 0		NON_CIV_GROUP			NONE
 1		REBEL_CIV_GROUP			REBEL
 2		KINGPIN_CIV_GROUP		KINGPIN
 3		SANMONA_ARMS_GROUP		SANMONA ARMS
 4		ANGELS_GROUP			ANGELS

 5		BEGGARS_CIV_GROUP		BEGGARS
 6		TOURISTS_CIV_GROUP		TOURISTS
 7		ALMA_MILITARY_CIV_GROUP		ALMA MIL
 8		DOCTORS_CIV_GROUP		DOCTORS
 9		COUPLE1_CIV_GROUP		COUPLE1

10		HICKS_CIV_GROUP			HICKS
11		WARDEN_CIV_GROUP		WARDEN
12		JUNKYARD_CIV_GROUP		JUNKYARD
13		FACTORY_KIDS_GROUP		FACTORY KIDS
14		QUEENS_CIV_GROUP		QUEENS

15		UNNAMED_CIV_GROUP_15		UNUSED15
16		UNNAMED_CIV_GROUP_16		UNUSED16
17		UNNAMED_CIV_GROUP_17		UNUSED17
18		UNNAMED_CIV_GROUP_18		UNUSED18
19		UNNAMED_CIV_GROUP_19		UNUSED19


"UNUSED" is crap! They are not unused and that is why this bug could occur in the first place.

Here is a list of NPCs using these "unused" numbers:

NPC		Number

Joey, Martha	15
Devin		16
Hamous		17
Terry		18
Dynamo, Shank	19


Smeagol certainly didn't know this when he placed his "mine guards" which he assigned faction "UNUSED19" on the WF maps. PVal must have killed one of these guards by accident and after that all members of this faction were hostile (including Dynamo and Shank).

If you want to reproduce this just do the following:
  • start a game with the WF maps
  • hire a merc/IMP
  • teleport to Drassen D13
  • kill one of the guards in the little guard shacks
  • get out of the sector and wait till after 00:00 o'clock <- this is important because at that time the "MercDailyUpdate" routine is run which will make all members of the guards faction hostile(including Dynamo and Shank)
  • teleport to Tixa and into Dynamo's cell, he will attack you as soon as he sees you

What needs to be done to fix this?
  • 1. update the "CivGroupNames.xml" to name the "not unused" slots (I'll send an updated one to RoWa)
  • 2. update the WF maps so that civilists use really free faction slots (I saw at least "UNUSED19" and "UNUSED15" in use by WF maps) <- *CAUTION* this will make the new maps useless for old Ja2 1.13 exe versions because they only know 20 factions! You will have to play these maps with a new exe which supports 255 different factions.
  • 3. update the appropriate civ###.edt so that these civilians have something useful to say instead of "quote 2", "quote 6" ... Wink
With the new names in place modders will know that these slots are in use and have to choose different ones.

[Updated on: Sun, 01 August 2010 15:55] by Moderator


Re: Beta-Testers for new 1.13 Features[message #258093] Sun, 01 August 2010 17:30 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Headrock

 
Messages:1795
Registered:March 2006
Location: Jerusalem
I wonder if this has anything to do with the rampant issues of various civvies going hostile in WF. I thought it had something to do with factions, but the only savegames offered for testing were incompatible with the EXE versions I was using at the time. The mercdailyupdate would be a good place to look for those errors though, so it's a good thing you discovered this!!!


Re: Beta-Testers for new 1.13 Features[message #258496] Thu, 05 August 2010 18:26 Go to previous messageGo to next message
svean

 
Messages:66
Registered:August 2005
If there is a chance to test something (especially NCTH system) count me in Smile

My friends (programming ones) say that I can crash almost any aplication with the reason noone could expect Wink I dont't really know if I should treat that as a compliment... Very Happy
Re: Beta-Testers for new 1.13 Features[message #258525] Fri, 06 August 2010 00:37 Go to previous messageGo to next message
RoWa21

 
Messages:2047
Registered:October 2005
Location: Austria
Yes of course you can test, but not yet the NCTH system. Write me a PM if you are intersted in testing the Closed Beta.


Re: Beta-Testers for new 1.13 Features[message #266235] Wed, 03 November 2010 16:20 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Sot

 
Messages:86
Registered:April 2009
Can shoot with both hands an automatic fire from SMG?
Re: Beta-Testers for new 1.13 Features[message #285798] Wed, 06 July 2011 13:19 Go to previous messageGo to next message
PasHancock

 
Messages:738
Registered:February 2011
Location: Estonia,Tallinn
any new Features coming?
Re: Beta-Testers for new 1.13 Features[message #285799] Wed, 06 July 2011 13:40 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Gorro der GrĂ¼ne

 
Messages:1570
Registered:March 2009
Location: Broadwurschd-City
this would be announced
Re: Beta-Testers for new 1.13 Features[message #294649] Thu, 08 December 2011 10:25 Go to previous message
usrbid

 
Messages:1580
Registered:December 2008
Unstickied per Schein's request as we believe the beta test is done by now.


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