Home » MODDING HQ 1.13 » v1.13 Modding, Customising, Editing » v1.13 Weapon & Item Refinement » WW II Mod
Re: Alternative Gun Progression[message #267606] Tue, 30 November 2010 20:01 Go to previous messageGo to next message
smeagol is currently offline smeagol

 
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Duplicate belt items obviously... that can be transformed via a merge from combat pack to vest....

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Lieutenant

Re: Alternative Gun Progression[message #267612] Tue, 30 November 2010 23:37 Go to previous messageGo to next message
smeagol is currently offline smeagol

 
Messages:2730
Registered:June 2008
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Hmm... without a small vest on top those belts look a bit weird... but I guess it will have to do...

http://img152.imageshack.us/img152/1808/ammobeltvest.gif

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Lieutenant

Re: Alternative Gun Progression[message #267615] Tue, 30 November 2010 23:58 Go to previous messageGo to next message
breversa

 
Messages:104
Registered:November 2010
I think they look okay... Smile

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Sergeant
Re: Alternative Gun Progression[message #267626] Wed, 01 December 2010 14:29 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Buns is currently offline Buns

 
Messages:656
Registered:September 2010
smeagol
Duplicate belt items obviously... that can be transformed via a merge from combat pack to vest....
Ah, I see. I thought it would be something more simple, like "change this number into that and it will be treated as a LBE vest".

I think in this case breversa's suggestion would be a better sollution: Adding a new vest that basically works as "carrier" for belts, similar to the Sniper Vest that already is in game. This could be a Field Jacket with two small and two tiny pockets, available in woodland, urban, and desert; something like that:

http://www.raeer.com/images/thumbs/28513-Belg-Fallschirmspring.gif

This would also adress the problem that the camo value of the vest overwrites that of the shirt. This shouldn't be the case when wearing a belt on this slot what would reduce the body camp value to "0" even when wearing a camo shirt.


-------------------------
update from my side:

I have started to revise Items.XML to adress the problem with Bobby Rays, Tony and other dealers in game. Changes include coolness, price, and number of items.

The coolness will be tied to the periode the weapon would appear; means a BAR is coolness "1" and should be available when having taken Drassen airport, while a Beretta 92 would be coolness "7" and that way will be available much later.

The price is solely tied to "usefulness" of a weapon by neglecting discounts or multiplicators for "old" or "new", what is completly controled by coolness anyways. "usefullness" is defined by damage, range and accurancy plus a modificator for semi-auto and full-auto weapons (does not apply to true sniper rifles).

Pistols cost around $500, rifles and shotguns around $750 to $1500, SMGs between $1000 and $2000, ARs and most LMGs between

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First Sergeant
Re: Alternative Gun Progression[message #267629] Wed, 01 December 2010 14:53 Go to previous messageGo to next message
breversa

 
Messages:104
Registered:November 2010
About the pre-placed weapons, what do you think of the following idea :

If the AKM is coolness 4 in normal v1.13, replace it with a tech level 4 weapon of the same type/use (maybe a Thompson M1A1 ?), *regardless of the early/mid/late-game target*. After all, not everyone plays the game the same : for instance, I'm aiming for Estoni/Cambria just after Omerta, and will take Drassen and Chitzena later.

EDIT :
BAR M1918 = tech/coolness level 1 ? I thought level 1 was made of weapons between 1901 and 1910, so it should be level 2, shouldn't it ?

[Updated on: Wed, 01 December 2010 14:57] by Moderator

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Sergeant
Re: Alternative Gun Progression[message #267634] Wed, 01 December 2010 16:53 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Buns is currently offline Buns

 
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Registered:September 2010
breversa
About the pre-placed weapons, what do you think of the following idea :

If the AKM is coolness 4 in normal v1.13, replace it with a tech level 4 weapon of the same type/use (maybe a Thompson M1A1 ?), *regardless of the early/mid/late-game target*. After all, not everyone plays the game the same : for instance, I'm aiming for Estoni/Cambria just after Omerta, and will take Drassen and Chitzena later.
This would have the same effect: a WWII weapon instead of a 1950s weapon.

Of course, as soon as you place any weapon on the map it might happen to be not fitting the current game progress. For example, Wildfire tells you to go to Chitzena first, but I always attack it last before going for Meduna. For the purpose of modding, we should assume that the player will do what he is told to, that is either goes for Chitzena or Drassen first; and that he will visit San Mona latest after having taken the first town.

Quote:
EDIT :
BAR M1918 = tech/coolness level 1 ? I thought level 1 was made of weapons between 1901 and 1910, so it should be level 2, shouldn't it ?
There is a level 0 in EnemyGunChoices but no coolness 0 in Items. For the purpose of BR, coolness 1 includes the weapons of the levels 0 and 1. But I think I indeed set the BAR and Browning LMG to coolness 2.

[Updated on: Wed, 01 December 2010 16:53] by Moderator

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First Sergeant
Re: Alternative Gun Progression[message #267635] Wed, 01 December 2010 16:59 Go to previous messageGo to next message
breversa

 
Messages:104
Registered:November 2010
Buns
For the purpose of modding, we should assume that the player will do what he is told to, that is either goes for Chitzena or Drassen first; and that he will visit San Mona latest after having taken the first town.


That's exactly my point : why ASSUME what the player is gonna do ? Why just not just replace the weapons with more appropriate ones of the equivalent coolness/tech level ?


Quote:
There is a level 0 in EnemyGunChoices but no coolness 0 in Items. For the purpose of BR, coolness 1 includes the weapons of the levels 0 and 1. But I think I indeed set the BAR and Browning LMG to coolness 2.


Thanks for clearing that out. Smile

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Sergeant
Re: Alternative Gun Progression[message #267645] Wed, 01 December 2010 18:34 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Buns is currently offline Buns

 
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breversa
That's exactly my point : why ASSUME what the player is gonna do ? Why just not just replace the weapons with more appropriate ones of the equivalent coolness/tech level ?
Those placed now are placed by the same system: by assuming the player visits the sectors in a certain logical order. When you take Drassen as your fourth town the Garand you find in the ACA building would be a joke because the enemies defending it would already have dropped much better weapons, regardless whether we are talking about standard Wildfire or BAG-Pro. Only when you attack Drassen as your first or second town the Garand would be of much use, save for serving as a trade good. So, who placed the Garand behind this heavly locked door assumed the player would come there rather early in the game.

Or take placement of ammunition as another example: In BAG-Pro, finding a box of 7.92 Mauser in the early game would be very helpfull, while a box of 7.62 NATO would be pointless to find. At progress level 50+ it would be the other way round. So where do you place the box of Mauser where the box of Nato on the map?

[Updated on: Wed, 01 December 2010 18:36] by Moderator

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First Sergeant
Re: Alternative Gun Progression[message #267654] Wed, 01 December 2010 20:10 Go to previous messageGo to next message
breversa

 
Messages:104
Registered:November 2010
Well... er... come to *really* think of it, you just may be right ! Wink
Just pretend I did not ask anything, okay ? Razz

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Sergeant
Re: Alternative Gun Progression[message #268257] Tue, 14 December 2010 15:02 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Buns is currently offline Buns

 
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Registered:September 2010
Update:

New Items.XML is completed, trying to match the inventory of BR and other traders to the BAG-Pro system of "periodes".

Prices and numbers were changed too. There is no more discount for "crappy weapons", means pistols and non-sniper rifles in general are more expensive, and no more discount for Russian products, so eastern weapons cost about the same as comperable western designs. In return most of the modern weapons became much more cheaper by only taking into account the "naked weapon" that you get from BR, not the fancy attachments that make these weapons so expensive.

I have also seriously upped the numbers for standard equipment. The "1" for most items in BR's "normal" settings always was the main reason for me to choose "awesome" instead because when going to buy, say, helmets I don't need one helmet and another one next week but 12 or 15 helmets now.

I have started a new campaign and will do some testing; if everything is as expected I'll upload it with the new package.


I have also started to work on changing the maps myself; because no one volounteered Wink. Changes include findings, enemy equipment, and enemy orders.

Findings now should match the periode of progress. Of course it is impossible to predict when each sector will be visited the first time during a campaign. So I went for a approach by rows: Until row E (that is Omerta, San Mona, Drassen, Chitzena, the two SAMs, and the possible arsenal south of Drassen) findings will be pre-1950 technology. Rows F to K, that is Grum, Cambria, Alma, Tixa, and everything around, features about 1950 to 1980 technology, everything south of that the modern stuff. As usual you can stock yourself up with some advanced weapons by raiding Alma early on, but because ammunition is periodized too, neither the enemy nor any of the traders will drop/stock the respective amo (7.62 and 5.56) until progress 5 to 6.

The loot from Arulcan military facilities is matching the stuff the enemy actually is using. Because that would often not realy be a booty of to speak, when for example the enemy in battle had dropped five Garands and you find a sixth of it in the respective ACA building, boxes and the like that would be considered enemy deliveries often hold a lot of good enemy equipment in 100% condition, as if you had ordered it from BR. There are indeed a few places on the map where you can re-equip your entire team to new standards.

The random weapon arsenals, or barracks outside cities, such as E11 or H10 are always setup by a certain motto. For example, H10 is the barracks of Deidranna's "Desert Rats" where you can find a lot desert camo stuff that the enemy otherwise not is using.

There are also some "rebel weapon caches" were you can find Russian weapons, what otherwise are not used by the enemy.


I have also changed enemy equipment on the map in the way that there are only very, very few enemies with pre-placed equipment, and none with pre-placed weapons (only applies to the army, not to rouges like Kingpin's mob or the hillbillies). I have also set the relative equipment level for all enemies to "average" to prevent from occasional to early droppings of very advanced equippement on the one hand, and sticking to completly outdated stuff on the other hand.


While I was on it clicking on each of the 32 foes per map, I have made some changes to enemy orders and attitude. My goal was to make the enemy soldiers less sticking to the position they start the battle on and make them behave a bit more cooperative. This is first of all meant to get rid of the usual last hardcore campers that you have to search for across the entire map after the battle essentially is over. I not only consider them nothing but a nusinace for the player, I also don't think that these do the AI any good because they effectivly reduce its manpower in the main fighting.

The default order now is "Seek Enemy", what means the enemy is free to wander the entire map and respond to other enemies' sighting of your team. The default attitude is "Brave Aid" what means he prefers to open fire as soon as he sees your team (instead of searching for cover where there is none) and will call other enemies for help.

The experience from my first battles with these settings indeed make a much different gameplay. Battles can be much easyer, when all enemies happen to run into your MG; but they also can be much more difficult when after the first contact 32 enemies close in from all directions. In general battles, in particular at daytime, are more "hotter" in the way that after the first shot the game often doesn't return into realtime and give you an extensive firefight with all enemies in the sector until the battle realy is over.





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First Sergeant
Re: Alternative Gun Progression[message #268400] Thu, 16 December 2010 14:18 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Buns is currently offline Buns

 
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Updated first post with the new items file and the maps I have already changed, down to line H (in fact the download contains all maps because I was to lazy to sort them).

The new BR selection seems to be working as intended; example of BR selection at game start (Drassen airport taken on day one):

http://img59.imageshack.us/img59/3998/77772979.th.jpg



This is on normal (lowest) BR settings, please note the higher numbers for standard weapons (in this phase of the game most weapons would be considered "standard"), and the slightly different prices.


BTW, 25 download of the first draft and no feedback? Well, at least I like it....

[Updated on: Thu, 16 December 2010 14:18] by Moderator

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First Sergeant
Re: Alternative Gun Progression[message #268403] Thu, 16 December 2010 14:33 Go to previous messageGo to next message
breversa

 
Messages:104
Registered:November 2010
I'm sorry, Buns, but I've been so busy lately that I haven't even downloaded your update, even less try it... but I'm REALLY looking forward to it when I finally have some vacation at the end of the month. Smile

About your screenshot :
- Thompson M1928 already ?
- I can't tell when the first hi-cap M1911 appeared, but I'd say is a rather recent developement, maybe in the 80s... Do you have any hint of such a modification in the 1910s-20s ?

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Sergeant
Re: Alternative Gun Progression[message #268408] Thu, 16 December 2010 15:30 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Buns is currently offline Buns

 
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breversa
- Thompson M1928 already ?
Yes, BR adds +1 to the recent progress, means you might see level 2 weapons after taking Drassen (the screenshot in fact wasn't taken directly after conquest of Drassen airport, but after conquest of all of Drassen; still day #1 though).

Quote:
- I can't tell when the first hi-cap M1911 appeared, but I'd say is a rather recent developement, maybe in the 80s... Do you have any hint of such a modification in the 1910s-20s ?
I don't have the slightest idea since when the high cap is in production. A lot of stuff is more or less guesswork. For example, the Krieghoff already is available because Krieghoff is producing hunting rifle since the late 19th Century and the Nitro Express amo is actually a development of the early 1900s. For the same reason you are able to buy .50 BMG amo from BR on game start, despite the respective vintage weapon (the Browning M2 MG) not is in game.

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First Sergeant
Re: Alternative Gun Progression[message #268409] Thu, 16 December 2010 15:42 Go to previous messageGo to next message
breversa

 
Messages:104
Registered:November 2010
I don't know about Krieghoff rifles, but I came to the same conclusion as you. Comme to think of it, is there any pump-action rifle available at game start (the Winchester M1897 saw action during WW1) ?

Do you mean that the .50 BMG round is available by the time you reach Drassen because it has been developped in 1920-1921 (source : Wikipedia) ?

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Sergeant
Re: Alternative Gun Progression[message #268410] Thu, 16 December 2010 16:06 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Buns is currently offline Buns

 
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breversa
I don't know about Krieghoff rifles, but I came to the same conclusion as you. Comme to think of it, is there any pump-action rifle available at game start (the Winchester M1897 saw action during WW1) ?
There is no Winchester M1897 in game. The earlyest pump action gun is the Ithaca 37. Tex starts with one; you also find one in Omerta and two or so in Drassen. The enemy will also be using it in very small numbers around the early-mid game.

Quote:
Do you mean that the .50 BMG round is available by the time you reach Drassen because it has been developped in 1920-1921 (source : Wikipedia) ?
Yup. When doing ammunition I didn't cross-checked it for the weapons in game but just looked up when this type was actually developed.

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First Sergeant
Re: Alternative Gun Progression[message #268411] Thu, 16 December 2010 16:17 Go to previous messageGo to next message
breversa

 
Messages:104
Registered:November 2010
Both your answers suit me fine. Smile

Regarding ammo availability : good idea ! While it may allow a cunning player to stock up on heavy rounds, it's nonetheless "historically" correct. Smile

And who knows, if ChrisL (L/M/H)MG code update can be applied to a tripod item, why couldn't the Browning M2 make it in game as early as 1920-1930 ? Wink

[Updated on: Thu, 16 December 2010 16:19] by Moderator

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Sergeant
Re: Alternative Gun Progression[message #268412] Thu, 16 December 2010 16:32 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Buns is currently offline Buns

 
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Concerning shotguns in general: they are rather useless in this mod when you find stuff like Mosin-Nagants around every other corner as early as Omerta. The only advantage that the Ithaca has over the Mosin-Nagant is its lower costs for re-chambering; otherwise it's just equal in damage and inferior in every other aspect. When I had hired the entire M.E.R.C. team I had Tex switching from the shotgun to akimbo shooting two 38er already in the second or third battle. And finally I gave it up with 12g and issued him the next Springfield in half-way acceptable condition I came around.

[Updated on: Thu, 16 December 2010 16:32] by Moderator

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First Sergeant
Re: Alternative Gun Progression[message #269210] Sat, 01 January 2011 15:16 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Buns is currently offline Buns

 
Messages:656
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Updated first post with new download:

All maps are now completed, save for P3 what gave me a CTD anytime I tried to save it. I have removed all pre-placed weapons from enemies, what will also ease further improvement of this mod and changes in the set-up of the enemy army. By the way I had also changed enemy behaviour to allow them moving across the map at will, and removed "priority" tags in most cases, trying to give the maps more replayability.

Weapon caches that are considered belonging to the Arulcan army indeed hold stuff the enemy is usually using himself. This is a bit problematic concerning current game progress and level of the weapons found, in the way that the findings might either be considered "outdated" or "SF". To have the game progress approximatly matching the findings, I would suggest to work yourself through Arulco from north to south. Raiding some targets in the south early on, such as Alma, might give a large ammount of M16s and the like in 100% condition, but you would have a hard time finding ammo for it because also BR and Tony start stocking a certain amunition not before it would be accurate. In case of the 1960s 5.56er this would mean at some time between game progress 50 and 60.

Some weapon caches, in particular the random weapon arsenals, had been set up with a certain "background story", so there is a "Barracks of the Paratroopers", a "Barracks of the SWAT", an "Infantry School" where they teach jungle warfare, a "Testing Ground" where they test import-weapons (that finally didn't made it into arsenal of the regular army), there is a factory where they make grenades, and one where attachments are made, and so on (including a hint where Hans' porns are produced, and that bloodcats and bugs are not the only dangerous species out there Wink).

Because Russian weapons are rare in this set-up, I have placed three additional "secret weapon caches" with Russian weapons (one AKM, one AEK, one AS Val, always plus other goodies from Mother Russia). Consider them "help from Enrico". ATM these are fixed, means they are always there. May be later I'll make them random, means they might or might not appear, similar to the guarded weapon caches of the Arulcan army.

For the same reason you will occasionally find "supporters of your cause" somewhere accrosss the country. These are not additional RPCs or NPCs, but you'll find some fine weapons, money, explosives and other usefull stuff in their houses.

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First Sergeant
Re: Alternative Gun Progression[message #269539] Fri, 07 January 2011 14:15 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Buns is currently offline Buns

 
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Registered:September 2010
Looks like the core idea of this mod isn't working because game progression isn't taken into account when it comes to define weapons by EnemyGunChoices.XML. The major factor to define that indeed is the location of the sector (proximity to P3). see here for more infos: http://www.ja-galaxy-forum.com/board/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=244880#Post244880


That's a general problem of JA2, not one of BAG-Pro. The fact that you usually start in the NE corner of the map (Drassen) and then work yourself south and west gives you the impression that weaponary progress is tied to game progress, but it isn't. The mod so far works as long as you stick to the default ways, but as soon as you step out of the line, balance goes fubar. This is more obvious with BAG-Pro than with Vanilla JA2 or standard WF.


I think I'll return to my original concept of "no progression" and make a WWII weapon mod based on Wildfire out of this.

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First Sergeant
Re: Alternative Gun Progression[message #269573] Fri, 07 January 2011 22:02 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Badbru is currently offline Badbru

 
Messages:63
Registered:January 2008
Location: Perth Australia
Well, just to let you know, I've been thoroughly enjoying it anyway.

I followed your suggestions and played with drop all on for the first time ever in my first game.
That was interesting. I also played my usual way and went straight for Estoni and Tixa.

I got stuck in Tixa for two or three counterattacks waiting for Dynamo to heal and ended up with lots of HK 33's with a wide variety of attachments. I went to Alma next and then stopped that game.

Started a new game and played er, traditional? ie I went to Drassen first and then to Cambria.
Gun and gear progression appears to work fine doing that. In that game I now hold Drassen Cambria and Chitzena. Nothing in 5.56 yet and mostly only preplaced FN FALs in 7.62Nato showing up. My best kit in that game has come from the weapon cache near Grumm Estoni Cambria crossroads, or from buying AK kits from Tony and AKM's from used section of BR's.

Anyway I just wanted to say thanks for your effort and it wasn't wasted and that it still kinda works. It's certainly been a very different JA2 experience and that is never a bad thing.

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Corporal
Re: Alternative Gun Progression[message #269575] Fri, 07 January 2011 22:34 Go to previous messageGo to next message
breversa

 
Messages:104
Registered:November 2010
Buns, allow me to side along Badbru to express my gratitude for your work.

I'm currently playing with BAG-Pro (but not with modified maps yet), and while I went straight from Omerta to Estoni (to pick up Maddog), then Cambria (Vince), San Mona, Drassen and next Chitzena, I highly enjoy your modifications, and looking forward to your WW2 Wildfire mod ! Wink

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Sergeant
Re: Alternative Gun Progression[message #269595] Sat, 08 January 2011 10:20 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Dansken is currently offline Dansken

 
Messages:89
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Location: Norway
Although I haven't tried BAG-Pro (been too busy lately), I'd like to say that I love the idea and was really looking forward to using your mod on my next playthrough.

Please don't give up on a great idea ... so much work have been done already, changing all the maps! All that's needed now is a little help from a coder to include an ini-option to bypass standard EnemyGunChoice-calculation and have it based on game progress alone?

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Corporal 1st Class
Re: Alternative Gun Progression[message #269807] Mon, 10 January 2011 17:11 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Buns is currently offline Buns

 
Messages:656
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This mod isn't "dead", it's in fact completed. The thing is that it is ATM not working as it should due to limitations of the engine. Next thing would be to wait for someone fixing the hardcoded stuff tieing EnemyGunChoices to progression. That's beyond my abilities.


Concerning WWII-mod, yes, but I would like to have some more stuff included, like some more weapons (MG42, FG42 etcpp.), and may be some WWI/II era helmets, uniforms and LBE. In case anyone seasoned in adding stuff would like to help, please drop a note.

Meanwhile I have started a new project on this topic; more later....

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First Sergeant
Re: Alternative Gun Progression[message #269936] Tue, 11 January 2011 18:24 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Buns is currently offline Buns

 
Messages:656
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Some first thoughts about turning this into a WWII weapon-mod for Wildfire, using the stuff that is in it anyways:

There will be no progression in weapons. That is for the reason that these weapons don't have a default "hierachy". A Mauser 98 not is per se better than a MP-40. It is better suited for long range shooting but about useless in CQB. In fact, at night in high gras you'd rather draw your pistol than trying to survive with a bolt-action rifle. This means the JA default succession of pistol-MP-rifle wouldn't apply to WWII weapons where you don't have the all-purpose ARs.

OK, a Garand is better than a Mauser 98, and an AVS-36 probably more usefull than a Mosin-Nagant; but making some kind of progression that way would be highly artifically with that little ammount of vintage weapons available at all.

In a first concept I have made several different sets of 10 weapons each; as usual containing rifles, pistols, SMGs and LMGs (the later don't appear in each set). These are set up by origing: US, Euro, SU. Each "level" in EnemyGunChoices has two sets of US weapons, two of Euro weapons, and one of Russian weapons. So there should always be about an larger number of enemies armed with Garands, Thompons and the like, the same number with 98Ks, MP-40s and the like, and a smaller number with PPsh, Mosin-Nagants and the like.

An exception are the two last levels, in particular level 10 (that's the last defenders of Meduna): These do have AK-47s and SKS. These weapons should also be in Orta, otherwise they would not available. This also requires to tweak Tony's inventory, but I am planning to do some changes to the dealers around anyways, making the game less dependent on BR or findings.


Armor would limited to steel helmets, camo steel helmets, and flak jackets, plus the usual non-armor stuff.


Not sure what to do with LBE.

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First Sergeant
Re: Alternative Gun Progression[message #269937] Tue, 11 January 2011 18:27 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Logisteric

 
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Registered:December 2008
Location: B
how about fg, stg, mg42 or panzerschreck which were developped during the war?

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Captain
Re: Alternative Gun Progression[message #269940] Tue, 11 January 2011 18:34 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Buns is currently offline Buns

 
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Yep, FG and Stg were already named. So far, with the stuff WF is offering ATM, I can only offer the AK-47 as a stand-in. AT-weapons is another topic. Also here I think I go for older Russian stuff (RPG).

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First Sergeant
Re: Alternative Gun Progression[message #269943] Tue, 11 January 2011 18:51 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Logisteric

 
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Location: B
i thought of game progress - shouldn't they appear later and not from the start - of course you need them

something like:

level 1/2: anything they had in 1939
level 3/4: anything they had in 1940

...


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Captain
Re: Alternative Gun Progression[message #269944] Tue, 11 January 2011 19:12 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Buns is currently offline Buns

 
Messages:656
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Logisteric
i thought of game progress - shouldn't they appear later and not from the start - of course you need them

something like:

level 1/2: anything they had in 1939
level 3/4: anything they had in 1940
This would run into the same problem as BAG-Pro: as soon as you have your first mine, weapon progress no longer is tied to game progress but to the location of the battle.

Making a "Wehrmacht" setup for the Arulcan army could look that way that most of the weapons would be 98Ks, MG34 and 42, various SMGs, P-38, P-08s, and probably with some loot-weapons mixed in. In each setup there would be a small ammount of StuG44 and an even smaller number of FG42; something like four (out of 50) StuG and two FGs. So they would be there, but the chance to come across it would be rather small, means by probability you have to fight a lot of enemies before one of them drops a FG42.

An exception would be "Level 0" and "Level 10". Of Level 0 we can be sure it's the setup of the enemies when landing in Omerta. "Level 10" always is the kit of the soldiers around Deidranna's F

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First Sergeant
Re: Alternative Gun Progression[message #269947] Tue, 11 January 2011 19:19 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Logisteric

 
Messages:3228
Registered:December 2008
Location: B
mine was a historical consideration not one of gameplay, and hey it's your mod

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Captain
Re: Alternative Gun Progression[message #269952] Tue, 11 January 2011 19:31 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Buns is currently offline Buns

 
Messages:656
Registered:September 2010
Well, it's a mod about historical weapons, so any historical suggestion is appreciated. The thing is that with the current way weapon progression works tieing it to historical progression doesn't realy work, unless we have a valid reason to say why enemies one sector south of Tixa have access to much newer weapons than those one sector north of Cambria (the difference between both indeed is about three levels).

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First Sergeant
Re: Alternative Gun Progression[message #270030] Wed, 12 January 2011 13:03 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Buns is currently offline Buns

 
Messages:656
Registered:September 2010
Buns
Not sure what to do with LBE


I think the best sollution would be to move the belts to the chest slot:

http://img291.imageshack.us/img291/341/lbesol.jpg

that way you are able to carry a belt and an assault pack. This would also prevent from the chest slot going unsed, without the need to allow for anachronistcal LBE-vests. Only problem would be that the belt overwrites the camo-value of the shirt. But in this mod your guys usually would be wearing a woodland camo-shirt, so belts can be given the same camo value (18% wood). This would not be additionally but the camo-value would stay the same, only be read (technically) from the belt.


Not sure if anything can be done about pockets without changing graphics, but this one for example should also have a canteen slot and two-grenades clip.

[Updated on: Wed, 12 January 2011 13:05] by Moderator

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First Sergeant
Re: Alternative Gun Progression[message #270170] Thu, 13 January 2011 13:20 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Buns is currently offline Buns

 
Messages:656
Registered:September 2010
Buns
Not sure if anything can be done about pockets without changing graphics, but this one for example should also have a canteen slot and two-grenades clip.


Yes, works without problems. So here are the new "Arulcan Military Belts", worn on the vest-slot

http://img199.imageshack.us/img199/7223/beltinew.jpg
Standard issue Arulcan M1923A2 Infantry Belt with a canteen-clip, four pouches for rifle clips, and a clip for handgrenades (the A1 has a case for a spade instead).

http://img28.imageshack.us/img28/3481/beltsmg.jpg
Arulcan M1923/31 Assault Belt with SMG mag pouches instead of the rifle pouches. Can also be used with M1 Carbine magazines.

http://img811.imageshack.us/img811/5295/beltmg.jpg
Arulcan M1927 Artillery Belt. This kind of belt is usually worn by MG gunners or SMG gunners that use drum magazines. It does not have magazine pouches but a pistol holster and small utility pouch for a cleaning kit.

http://img193.imageshack.us/img193/772/beltoffz.jpg
This is the new Arulcan M1931 Offizer's Belt. It has a canteen clip instead of the scabbard, two magazine pouches for M1 Carbine magazines, a case for a binoculars, and a pistol holster.

http://img713.imageshack.us/img713/1599/beltcnew.jpg
Arulcan M1921 Cavalry Belt. It is similar to the infantry belt but features an additional holster. This one also is much in use by snipers and NCOs.

http://img535.imageshack.us/img535/2425/beltiold.jpg
This one is the old (M1881) Arulcan Infantry Belt, still in use with some reserve units. It has four small pouches to hold lose rounds, a canteen clip, and a bread-bag with a capacity of 1,000gr of hard-bread (can also be used to hold a large grenade or drum magazine).

http://img191.imageshack.us/img191/4337/beltcold.jpg
Modificated old Arulcan Cavalry Belt. The scabbard was removed to mount a canteen-clip.

http://img254.imageshack.us/img254/8136/beltdh.jpg
Double Holster Belt, not in use by the Aurlcan Army.

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First Sergeant
Re: Alternative Gun Progression[message #270172] Thu, 13 January 2011 13:23 Go to previous messageGo to next message
breversa

 
Messages:104
Registered:November 2010
Man, you have such an imagination ! That's AWESOME work ! Congratulations ! Very Happy

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Sergeant
Re: Alternative Gun Progression[message #270188] Thu, 13 January 2011 16:38 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Anonymous
Questions:

What exactly are combat packs?
Are they smaller back packs or butt packs?
How can they hold rockets and rocket launchers?
If they are butt packs, in your mod Buns, how can you use a belt and a butt pack at the same time?
Do you wear a butt pack on a belt?
Do you wear a belt on a butt pack?

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Re: Alternative Gun Progression[message #270191] Thu, 13 January 2011 16:50 Go to previous messageGo to next message
AZAZEL is currently offline AZAZEL

 
Messages:750
Registered:February 2004
Lol, what a yoyo..Enough to get the man scared of the weight of changing.

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First Sergeant
Re: Alternative Gun Progression[message #270193] Thu, 13 January 2011 17:00 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Buns is currently offline Buns

 
Messages:656
Registered:September 2010
taoteching
What exactly are combat packs?
Combat Packs are small to medium sized bags to hold rations, hygiene articles, field-cutlery, spare ammo and the like. An oldfashioned German term is "Brotbeutel" (bread-bag).

Quote:
Are they smaller back packs or butt packs?
A butt pack rather is a combination of several combat packs.

Quote:
How can they hold rockets and rocket launchers?
They cannot (unless by a sling). In fact pouches in side-packs should be limited to the medium sized CP pouches.

Quote:
If they are butt packs, in your mod Buns, how can you use a belt and a butt pack at the same time?
Do you wear a butt pack on a belt?
Do you wear a belt on a butt pack?
The combat pack can be fixed to the belt, or to the suspender (I think that's the correct term in English). It can also be worn seperatly from the shoulder, even two from both shoulders in an X. The butt pack would usually be fixed to the backside of the belt (hence its name).

NB that all the belts above only have pouches on the front side and clips (or holsters) on the sides. The backside is free because that's the place where you have a butt pack. Wearing a belt would not prevent you wearing a combat pack.

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First Sergeant
Re: Alternative Gun Progression[message #270194] Thu, 13 January 2011 17:05 Go to previous messageGo to next message
breversa

 
Messages:104
Registered:November 2010
taoteching

If they are butt packs, in your mod Buns, how can you use a belt and a butt pack at the same time?
Do you wear a butt pack on a belt?
Do you wear a belt on a butt pack?


I guess taoteching wants to know WHERE do you wear the combat pack. From what I understand, it's worn INSTEAD of an LBE vest, and therefore CAN be worn along with a butt pack.

Buns
So here are the new "Arulcan Military Belts", worn on the vest-slot

[Updated on: Thu, 13 January 2011 17:07] by Moderator

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Sergeant
Re: Alternative Gun Progression[message #270196] Thu, 13 January 2011 17:13 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Buns is currently offline Buns

 
Messages:656
Registered:September 2010
breversa
I guess taoteching wants to know WHERE do you wear the combat pack. From what I understand, it's worn INSTEAD of an LBE vest, and therefore CAN be worn along with a butt pack.
Yes, the combat packs and butt packs will stay on the side-slot. That way you can wear a belt together with a combat pack - but could not together with a LBE vest. This is a more logical setup IMHO because an ammunition belt is worn on the belly, not the hip. Therefore you would not be able to use a LBE-vest together with an ammo-belt.

German Brotbeutel M1931:

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/1/1f/Milit%C3%A4rbrotbeutel_M1931_%28German_bread_bag%29.jpg/220px-Milit%C3%A4rbrotbeutel_M1931_%28German_bread_bag%29.jpg

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First Sergeant
Re: Alternative Gun Progression[message #270198] Thu, 13 January 2011 17:23 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Anonymous
el_ozaziel
Lol, what a yoyo..Enough to get the man scared of the weight of changing.
How the hell can you context words that I type on a screen? That is just a reflection of yourself bud.

@Buns
Thanks for taking the time to answer my questions.

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Re: Alternative Gun Progression[message #270204] Thu, 13 January 2011 17:39 Go to previous messageGo to previous message
Slax is currently offline Slax

 
Messages:1427
Registered:July 2006
Location: People riding polar bears...
Some good stuff you've got going here, Buns. Loving the Arulcan gear. :smilingsoldier:

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Sergeant Major
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