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About +P+ 9mm[message #311801] Mon, 05 November 2012 16:45 Go to next message
AquaRegia

 
Messages:25
Registered:March 2008
1) What are the lists of the guns that can use +P+ ammo without the risk of damaging them?
2) I cannot find +P+ version of .40 and .45ACP. Are they in the game? At least the 10mm rounds have AET choice.
3) Is +P+ 9mm ammo good alternatives for 5.7mm(FNP90)or 4.6mm(MP7) in the real world and game? Could use a weapon expert to explain on this one.
Re: About +P+ 9mm[message #311802] Mon, 05 November 2012 16:51 Go to previous messageGo to next message
DepressivesBrot

 
Messages:3746
Registered:July 2009
Did you maybe mean to post that over in the UC1.13 board? To my knowledge wil is the only one who makes any distinction of high pressure 9mm loads.


Re: About +P+ 9mm[message #311803] Mon, 05 November 2012 17:20 Go to previous messageGo to next message
AquaRegia

 
Messages:25
Registered:March 2008
Yes. Can you please transfer the post to UC 1.13 section, so I don't to spam or repost.
Re: About +P+ 9mm[message #311808] Mon, 05 November 2012 18:39 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Gambigobilla

 
Messages:719
Registered:July 2008
1. Every kind of ammo damages the gun, not just +P+ rounds. +P+ rounds have a malus to the weapon reliability, so they damage the gun more than any ammo. If your gun has a reliability bonus it will negate the penalty from the ammo.

2. Currently i'm using 3.75 and there is only for 9x19, 7.65x17, and .45 Colt.

3. They both have nice bonuses, whatever floats your boats i'd say.
Re: About +P+ 9mm[message #312466] Sun, 25 November 2012 22:34 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Mercury-FMJ

 
Messages:18
Registered:November 2012
NitricRound

3) Is +P+ 9mm ammo good alternatives for 5.7mm(FNP90)or 4.6mm(MP7) in the real world and game? Could use a weapon expert to explain on this one.


In real life, +P 9mm ammo is more powerful than either 5.7 or 4.6., and so is regular 9mm. PDW's (personal defense weapons, i.e P90, MP7, KACPDW etc.)are greatly exaggerated in-game. They fire bullets that are tiny, and their energy is very low, even lower than 9x19mm: 9mm has 9.01mm diameter bullet, and about 450 foot-pounds force with a medium-weight bullet, and the five-seven has a 5.7mm bullet and about 400 foot-pound force. 4.6 is even weaker with 4.65mm diameter bullet and only about 350 foot-pound force with a medium weight bullet.
So that means that unless these bullets have really good terminal ballistics (as in, they fragment into pieces and spread out a lot, or they tumble around and their path curves inside the flesh)-which is very doubtful as they both have steel penetrating cores, which generally means that a bullet will go straight through without doing much- so they are going to do quite a lot less damage than a 9mm.

However, these personal defense rounds are basically like pistol-sized rifle rounds rather than pistol rounds.. so what that means is they have a long case that holds a large amount of gunpowder, combined with a small bullet. So it fires a small bullet at high velocity instead of a proper pistol round which has a larger bullet that travels at low velocity. 5.7mm rounds end up flying at about 2700-2900 feet per second, whereas a 9mm round goes about 1200 feet per second, or 1400 feet per second for a +P round. That means that the PDW rounds will probably have longer range. Also, PDW rounds are designed to defeat armour and they do that well - they can easily go through soft armour, such as kevlar, which usually stops 9mm. However PDW rounds still won't go through ceramic plates.
In real life, PDW's are made as an emergency weapon for when people are doing jobs that make it impractical for them to carry something better- they're not cannons. However they can also be useful as SMG's for swat team type people in close quarters, as in real life three of any bullet in the chest is probably going to stop someone; and they're definitely a much better choice if your enemies are wearing armour. But once the bullet gets in to the target, it is going to do quite a bit less damage than most SMG's.

[Updated on: Mon, 26 November 2012 00:38] by Moderator

Re: About +P+ 9mm[message #312515] Mon, 26 November 2012 20:15 Go to previous message
dinglehopper

 
Messages:134
Registered:January 2008
I wish it were so easy. While foot-pounds of force is a large contributor to damage potential, there is a lot more to it. Especially considering the values you are using are at the muzzle. For example if it were as easy as you say, the huge debate about whether .45 or .40 is better would be solved as .40 has much higher foot-pounds of force value than the .45 at the muzzle. (For what it is worth I am in the .40 is better crowd, but not because it has a higher foot-pound of force value at the muzzle).

Also, just to nitpick, you are using the medium-weight +P+ value for the 9mm but the low grain values for the others, the 4.6 is closer to 375 foot-pounds. But chances are this is not intentional on your part, but a product of getting your data from wiki. And it is a bit misleading, as you drop the
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