Home » FULL CONTROL GAMES » #JAFDEV » Community Wishlist for JA:F
Re: Community Wishlist for JA:F[message #332985] Thu, 22 May 2014 14:23 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Slax

 
Messages:1439
Registered:July 2006
Location: People riding polar bears...
Can't really rate the final product based on an alpha. The community's here to tidy these things up, give input. Help fix and improve the game! I could of course be wrong. Razz
Hell, give us source code access and we'll do wonders for you. As Boss might say.

[Updated on: Thu, 22 May 2014 14:25] by Moderator


Re: Community Wishlist for JA:F[message #332992] Thu, 22 May 2014 16:15 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Drglord

 
Messages:15
Registered:May 2013
Right you are cracking me up. In development for 10 years 1.13. hihi No budget no company just some guy dedicated and spending time yeah that is a comparison. Well anyway good luck to your expectations i will be around in 2 or 3 years when the final product comes around.

I really wonder what was the total amount in kickstarter? Hint.
Re: Community Wishlist for JA:F[message #332993] Thu, 22 May 2014 16:20 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Drglord

 
Messages:15
Registered:May 2013
Take your blind hate???? I forgot about that? Dude are you serious? Blind hate???? For what the best game ever? Is that even trolling ? Or did you just wanted to write something?
Re: Community Wishlist for JA:F[message #332994] Thu, 22 May 2014 16:21 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Shanga

 
Messages:3543
Registered:January 2000
Location: Danubia
Slax, the engine is Unity. Unless you get source code of that (not from FC, they don't own Unity source) that's off limits.

But that's exactly why JA:F is important here. FC bought the license to develop games under Unity, right? That thing, if you wanted to make JA from scratch, would've costed you a pretty dollar. About 1500 per developer for 12 months. If you skip paying one month, your license resets (you lose all the payed months) and you need to pay 12 months again. About the shittiest licensing ever.

- So FC solved this problem for us. +1
- They made the game work with free Unity editor. +1
- They are externalizing as much as possible in JSON files (stuff that in JA2 you move to INI) +1
- In next update we'll probably see hard-coded stuff about weapons and items be externalized too.

...and the list goes on.

What trolls don't get is that we do not need a pretty game. If JA:F makes good sales, hell it's wonderful. We'll probably get more modding cookies in next edition. If it has modest sales THE LEAST we get is a mod-friendly Unity engine already customized for JA2 theme. I support FC and wish them all the luck in selling JA:F. Cause it's always easier when somebody else makes your work. But we handled 15 years of JA2 with no dev support just fine at Bear's Pit. We'll be fine for the next 15 years.


Re: Community Wishlist for JA:F[message #332995] Thu, 22 May 2014 16:27 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Shanga

 
Messages:3543
Registered:January 2000
Location: Danubia
Dragonlord
Take your blind hate???? I forgot about that? Dude are you serious? Blind hate???? For what the best game ever? Is that even trolling ? Or did you just wanted to write something?


You're comparing apples and oranges. JA2 v1.13 or AFS, even old mods such as Urban Chaos ARE NOT VANILLA JA2. JA2UC took three years to make. JA2 v1.13 and any mods made on it (AFS & others) the product of 10 years of research and development. So if you want proper comparison try playing JA2 Demo first. Come back and tell us about the diversity of weapons, characters and all that when you're done. Compare JA2 Demo to JA:F beta version. Otherwise you're blind to any obvious arguments and just trolling.

FYI on Twitch TV I stream JA:F playthroughs almost every week-end. Last stream was of JAF EA beta. You can even compare that and the Alpha streams and see if there's any changes for yourself. Soon there will be a new release and a new stream. If you want to be informed when you talk about JAF at least stay up to date.

[Updated on: Thu, 22 May 2014 16:30] by Moderator



Re: Community Wishlist for JA:F[message #332997] Thu, 22 May 2014 18:40 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Slax

 
Messages:1439
Registered:July 2006
Location: People riding polar bears...
Dunno, I see Unity as a problem. By that I mean that not having full access (no pun intended) to the engine can become a problem. But, what do I know? I have no idea about what the dev kit and editor has to offer.

I personally don't like the look and feel of the game right now. Much too colorful in tactical and poor camera control. A game I feel did it better is 7.62. While fixed camera angles CAN work, having full control in a 3D game like this pretty much feels obligatory. I won't fully comment on arsenal, gunplay and progression until things get more fleshed out but my first impression on how inventory overall and items look isn't very good. More JA Back in Action than the classics, which is bad.

Guess I want something fully built on 1.13 research more than anything else.

Re: Community Wishlist for JA:F[message #332998] Thu, 22 May 2014 20:26 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Shanga

 
Messages:3543
Registered:January 2000
Location: Danubia
Well I found changing materials/textures for ground and other stuff (trees) very easy. You just edit them through the editor then in a graphic tool (any with Targa/TGA support works). I can say that changing the "looks" of the game (earth, grass and trees in special) will a 5 minute job.

So far I don't know how to save the edited materials inside the game (they only appear in the editor). But that step will come. I'll post a few screenshots soon so you can see what I mean.

The dev AssetBundle is ... a bundle of JA:F objects, from grass to houses and dynamic lights. Which can be edited. I already found out how to edit the texture of 3D objects (DDS). Animations (poses) will come. Merc+enemy stats + weapon and weapon penalties + armor and armor bonus are already editable in Notedpad (JSON files). You can also a lot more stuff with Notepad, like the morning/day/evening/night time. Or quests and triggers. A lot of small details are externalized. Even more will come.

So... what makes a game?

Maps(*), quests(*), story(*), textures(*), objects/bodies and animation, cameras. All the (*) are already editable. The rest are coming. What else you'd think you'd need to make a "JA2 like" mod? You ask and I'll tell you if they're editable.

[Updated on: Thu, 22 May 2014 20:27] by Moderator



Re: Community Wishlist for JA:F[message #333001] Thu, 22 May 2014 21:06 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Slax

 
Messages:1439
Registered:July 2006
Location: People riding polar bears...
I'm mostly dreading that the voice work will be poor right now. JA is a solid character driven experience and something like a voice can make a world of difference. Can't skimp on the quality of that one bit. I'd very much like to hear some new unknown talent popping up. The folks from JA1/2 did an absolutely tremendous job while, let's say, AAA talent (same voice in every game they're in) and Russian developers (overall poor quality, people even seem "lost" at times) just cheaply gloss the whole thing over and hope no one notices. New talent can of course come qith some problems but they may very well be positive quirks in the end.

It would be very positive if we could help pick and choose in this process. A community built (to some degree) character base just seems like a good idea. From the very start I got the impression that backer and community input would be key for this project. "Very nice", I thought. The open modding aspect is of course a big plus but building a mod on a solid foundation is even better. I'd go so far as to call JA2 a timeless classic, with a visible formula, a few secrets and most important of all, charm! This point is important, damn it! :charm:

Re: Community Wishlist for JA:F[message #333003] Thu, 22 May 2014 21:16 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Flugente

 
Messages:3170
Registered:April 2009
Location: Germany
In case you are proposing character voices from the community... Hell no. At best that would be on WF-levels, which is gruesome.


Re: Community Wishlist for JA:F[message #333004] Thu, 22 May 2014 21:31 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Shanga

 
Messages:3543
Registered:January 2000
Location: Danubia
While I researched streaming JA:F on Twitch I was also interested in finding some decent audio setup. I can tell you doing quality voice work doesn't cut it with your 10 euro headphones. Unless you're an audiophile or someone working with audio tools, you need to invest at least a couple hundred euros. A set of Astro A40 headphones + amp is about 250 euro and that's about the cheapest all-in one solution. But while you can get away with that for streaming (where your sound quality is limited by bandwidth anyway and everyone is more focused on gaming, not your ugly mutt), for a home studio recording solution you must invest more.

A proper setup is:

- audio insulated room/enclosure
- studio voice mike + mouth filters
- a studio headset
- a mike stand
- professional hardware amplifier + processing software
- professional audio card

This is why most user-recorded voices sound like shit (beside natural talent and accent and reading/acting experience). They think a low end/two cent hardware does the job. No it does not.

If you still want to record for JA:F, ask our friend Toxic. He owns a recording studio. He can give you all the pro details, maybe even help with reprocessing the sound.

[Updated on: Thu, 22 May 2014 21:37] by Moderator



Re: Community Wishlist for JA:F[message #333005] Thu, 22 May 2014 21:48 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Shanga

 
Messages:3543
Registered:January 2000
Location: Danubia
Official stand is

Quote:
"The best option for us would be to use our contacts, the community and parts of the team to the VO, but only if the quality is good enough."


Their contacts including the "Honest Trailer" guy who did the last voice work for the EA version.


Re: Community Wishlist for JA:F[message #333008] Thu, 22 May 2014 22:04 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Slax

 
Messages:1439
Registered:July 2006
Location: People riding polar bears...
Alright. Good to know. Smile

...been wanting to do a good merc voice :whistle:

Re: Community Wishlist for JA:F[message #334175] Sat, 12 July 2014 12:46 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Stapel
Messages:2
Registered:September 2004
Hello everybody, long time no see......

As the missus forced me to tidy up some stuff, I ran through old JA boxes. Wondering about the status of any sequences, I checked at steam and found out there actually are some developments, and that some even run on my iMac.

I purchased and downloaded JA-F right away. And now I find myself wondering what I can do increase the chances of getting this project succesful....

My first to comments would be this:
-no possibility to make saves? I can see the point of not making any saves in the middle of a battle, but not making any saves at all, aart form the solitude autosave, seems rather wrong, especially considering this is still Alpha.
-No interrupts? That's really bad, not?

[Updated on: Sat, 12 July 2014 12:46] by Moderator

Re: Community Wishlist for JA:F[message #334176] Sat, 12 July 2014 12:52 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Shanga

 
Messages:3543
Registered:January 2000
Location: Danubia
You bought a very early beta version mate. Saves and interrupts are in the works.


Re: Community Wishlist for JA:F[message #334178] Sat, 12 July 2014 14:23 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Stapel
Messages:2
Registered:September 2004
Shanga
You bought a very early beta version mate. Saves and interrupts are in the works.


That's good to hear!

Is there a place where I can find info on progress? There's probably a set date for the next version!
Re: Community Wishlist for JA:F[message #334179] Sat, 12 July 2014 14:40 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Shanga

 
Messages:3543
Registered:January 2000
Location: Danubia
Usually their forums is a good place to be if you want to be up to date (www.jaggedallianceflashback.com)


Re: Community Wishlist for JA:F[message #335006] Fri, 15 August 2014 14:11 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Rambo919

 
Messages:15
Registered:July 2012
Location: South Africa
Two things:
Keep it low sci-fi; no occult stuff, religion of mumbo jumbo please. I'm here to shoot things not "return idols to rightfull owners" that causes all sorts of cheery events to magically happen... was major flaw in the bitcomposer games IMO.

If possible work in language and/or violence filters. Watching people blow into hundreds of bits is fun for a while but then it gets just plain nauseating. Even though I found it very easy to mod the language usage of JA2 down to a more convenient level it really was a pain to have to do it in the first place.
Re: Community Wishlist for JA:F[message #335007] Fri, 15 August 2014 14:22 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Rambo919

 
Messages:15
Registered:July 2012
Location: South Africa
Shanga
Official stand is

Quote:
"The best option for us would be to use our contacts, the community and parts of the team to the VO, but only if the quality is good enough."


Their contacts including the "Honest Trailer" guy who did the last voice work for the EA version.


Having him do a running storyline narration in cutscenes or loading screens or something would be awesome.
Re: Community Wishlist for JA:F[message #335398] Tue, 02 September 2014 19:58 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Wigen
Messages:5
Registered:August 2014
Location: Poland
Jagged Alliance: Flashback has a chance to premiere later this year, despite so many mistakes? What do you think.

In my opinion, a more realistic date is 2015.

[Updated on: Tue, 02 September 2014 20:05] by Moderator

Re: Community Wishlist for JA:F[message #335399] Tue, 02 September 2014 20:16 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Shanga

 
Messages:3543
Registered:January 2000
Location: Danubia
The amount of changes they have implemented between each beta release was massive. Can't exactly say when the game will be in a finished state, all I hope they don't run out of money until they get there.

I'd rather have them take a break and release more Space Hulk games to milk more money than blow the JA:F release due to lack of funds. So if they need to release it in 2015, ok, just don't fuck up the game.


Re: Community Wishlist for JA:F[message #335405] Tue, 02 September 2014 21:54 Go to previous messageGo to next message
grim

 
Messages:300
Registered:July 2006
Location: France
I'd rather too, but if they really are running out of cash, they may put JAF on the market to get immediate cash. Of course, if they sell a half backed product, customers won't follow on the mid and long term...
Let's see what their final choice is.
Re: Community Wishlist for JA:F[message #335462] Thu, 04 September 2014 17:33 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Wigen
Messages:5
Registered:August 2014
Location: Poland
The new update and new realase date (21st October?)

https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/2079547763/jagged-alliance-flashback/posts
Re: Community Wishlist for JA:F[message #335533] Sat, 06 September 2014 14:09 Go to previous messageGo to next message
lockie

 
Messages:3969
Registered:February 2006
Location: Scotland
And......... underwhelmed by the mediocrity , sadly . This has a long way to go to be a must-play game . Sad


Re: Community Wishlist for JA:F[message #335556] Sun, 07 September 2014 00:33 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Mauser

 
Messages:797
Registered:August 2006
Location: Bavaria - Germany
lockie
And......... underwhelmed by the mediocrity , sadly . This has a long way to go to be a must-play game . Sad


True dat.

Too many essential features are still missing and it needs a LOT more content and balancing to live up to the expectations, so i see the announced October release date with some doubt.

Space Hulk was an awfully barebone and simple game for today's standards, even though it kept close to the original.

But then again, JA1 wasn't that big and polished either and neither was JA2 on release.

And seeing how the feature list of 1.13 keeps to grow rapidly still, which is quite astonishing to see, whatever FC is going to release will most likely dissapoint and feel somewhat anemic, even if all the basics are there and working well.

But then again, there are always content patches and updates and of course the modding community, whose job is to take the base game and flesh it out, polish it and turn it into something truly spectacular, just like 1.13 did for JA2.

And let's face it: the earlier we get our grubby little hands on the base game and the editors, the quicker the modders can take up their work. And since FC always wanted to work for the fans and with the modders, releasing a less than perfect base game and then keep fixing and improving it probably is the smartest move anyways.
Always remember: JA:F has a rather limited budget and barely made the crowdfunding goal. So we better not expect an AAA title quality. After all, FC promised us a fully moddable, solid base game with all the ESSENTIAL features and mechanics implemented and working. And that is really all we can ask for.

I think we'll be in for somethin akin to Shadowrun returns, where the released campaign was more a proof of concept for the editor and engine, whilst only the later released Dragonfall campaign showed the game's true potential and offered a proper and polished expanded gaming experience.

And really, i am rather ok with that.

Maybe FC can even do another Kickstarter fundraiser for improving and expanding the base game?

☆★GL★☆
Re: Community Wishlist for JA:F[message #335570] Sun, 07 September 2014 10:24 Go to previous messageGo to next message
tais

 
Messages:812
Registered:February 2008
Location: NL
Just release the source code... problem solved ;p


Re: Community Wishlist for JA:F[message #335583] Sun, 07 September 2014 13:42 Go to previous messageGo to next message
sirlach

 
Messages:47
Registered:June 2010
Location: Sydney, Australia
I've been thinking this over since the dev diary came out.

Have any of the modders or anyone from Bears Pit heard from FC in regards to the status of the game. Has there been an announcement that I may have missed outlining why the game is being released so early?

I thought that the $$$ from Space Hulk were supposed to support JAF development. I did notice that there FX guy Lee A had moved onto another company. Is there Big Trouble in Little Denmark?

Re: Community Wishlist for JA:F[message #335585] Sun, 07 September 2014 13:53 Go to previous messageGo to next message
lockie

 
Messages:3969
Registered:February 2006
Location: Scotland
Quote:
But then again, JA1 wasn't that big and polished either and neither was JA2 on release.


Comparing like for like , JAF doesn't even come close to BIA or Crossfire ... it just looks like an early alpha version unfortunately !

Remember they had all resources from these games to work with .

[Updated on: Sun, 07 September 2014 13:55] by Moderator



Re: Community Wishlist for JA:F[message #335588] Sun, 07 September 2014 14:29 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Rambo919

 
Messages:15
Registered:July 2012
Location: South Africa
They MIGHT have over reached themselves a bit by aiming more for 1.13 than for ja2. This will only be clear on release though. It can go any way at the moment I'm thinking.

[Updated on: Sun, 07 September 2014 14:29] by Moderator

Re: Community Wishlist for JA:F[message #335604] Sun, 07 September 2014 16:06 Go to previous messageGo to next message
grim

 
Messages:300
Registered:July 2006
Location: France
sirlach
Has there been an announcement that I may have missed outlining why the game is being released so early?

Andreas mentionned that the game was planned for November (since the Kickstarter), but they were in competition with big games over that period so they chose to release it in october (21).
(I can't find the thread where it was mentionned, but it was on JAF Forum)

Rambo919
They MIGHT have over reached themselves a bit by aiming more for 1.13 than for ja2.

How did they aim at 1.13 ? When i look at the game, i see more a JA (1) with 3D models and environment. The only touch of 1.13 is the effort put on modding, but we're still far from it, without source code. And no, we won't have it all, because they're building a tech (engine may be improper) for all their games.
Re: Community Wishlist for JA:F[message #335612] Sun, 07 September 2014 17:41 Go to previous messageGo to next message
batanen

 
Messages:24
Registered:May 2013
Grim

(I can't find the thread where it was mentionned, but it was on JAF Forum)


Kickstarter
Kickstarter
Release Date and Launch Price:

For those who don
Re: Community Wishlist for JA:F[message #335616] Sun, 07 September 2014 18:35 Go to previous messageGo to next message
lockie

 
Messages:3969
Registered:February 2006
Location: Scotland
Quote:
Box Art Draft art style is looking nice:


See , to me even that looks basic ...


Re: Community Wishlist for JA:F[message #335617] Sun, 07 September 2014 18:51 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Rambo919

 
Messages:15
Registered:July 2012
Location: South Africa
[quote=Grim]sirlach


Rambo919
They MIGHT have over reached themselves a bit by aiming more for 1.13 than for ja2.

How did they aim at 1.13 ? When i look at the game, i see more a JA (1) with 3D models and environment. The only touch of 1.13 is the effort put on modding, but we're still far from it, without source code. And no, we won't have it all, because they're building a tech (engine may be improper) for all their games.


I meant in overall philosophy and complexity, mere idle superficial speculation on my part. You have to remember that JA2 without 1.13 is basically a older more mature JA, 1.13 came and pumped in (is still pumping in) unheard of intensity so it's rather unfair to expect a new much shorter developed game go toe to toe with it.

The only real contender at release would be Wasteland 2 but that is a almost entirely different kind of beast so it's rather foolish to release earlier rather than later unless the cashflow is running seriously low.
Re: Community Wishlist for JA:F[message #335619] Sun, 07 September 2014 18:54 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Rambo919

 
Messages:15
Registered:July 2012
Location: South Africa
lockie
Quote:
Box Art Draft art style is looking nice:


See , to me even that looks basic ...


Either you are expecting too much or simply don't have the right art mindset Very Happy This is basically/almost a indie game pretending to be AAA after all, perhaps it's SUPPOSED to look basic/unpolished/catroonish.
Re: Community Wishlist for JA:F[message #335620] Sun, 07 September 2014 19:14 Go to previous messageGo to next message
grim

 
Messages:300
Registered:July 2006
Location: France
On that box art, keep in mind it's a DRAFT, and remember all JA box arts... They were all out of place with characters and stuff never to be seen in the game and such.
This one resemble more or less the first JA box, with actual characters met in the game.

[Updated on: Sun, 07 September 2014 19:15] by Moderator

Re: Community Wishlist for JA:F[message #335621] Sun, 07 September 2014 19:39 Go to previous messageGo to next message
DepressivesBrot

 
Messages:3788
Registered:July 2009
It took what, 5 years for someone to add the MPL into the game? Very Happy
Imo, if they are going for 'good old times' and 'trashy B-Movie', they are dead on with that cover.


Re: Community Wishlist for JA:F[message #335648] Tue, 09 September 2014 00:49 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Mauser

 
Messages:797
Registered:August 2006
Location: Bavaria - Germany
lockie
it just looks like an early alpha version unfortunately !


Jup, and it plays as dodgy as one too. After having played some more, i encountered quite a few bugs, mainly UI buttons not working under certain conditions, dropped items cannot be picked back up etc.

This is far from being enjoyable or even a beta version, this clearly is still an alpha in dire need of some profound patches, mainly for very basic content and features.
as of now, half of the essential game mechanics are still missing, like crafting, attachments, opening doors and crates and stuff to find in the maps. Also character stats & progression and first aid etc.
This is still a VERY basic game.

If that release date still stands, FC will have a VERY busy month ahead of them and we better start believing in wonders...

[Updated on: Tue, 09 September 2014 02:05] by Moderator


☆★GL★☆
Re: Community Wishlist for JA:F[message #336436] Fri, 03 October 2014 18:28 Go to previous messageGo to next message
yakapo

 
Messages:11
Registered:December 2011
One of my favorite aspects of ja2 was starting out with crappy handguns and limited ammo. I'm sure this sounds weird, but I didn't like to select "tons of guns" because it took away the value of finding rifles. I enjoyed fighting enemies who were much better equipped than I was.

---
I am not sure if anyone on this board has played the new xcom. But the game feels shallow and repetitive. They sacrificed a lot to make the game mainstream and 3d. The expansion helped somewhat... Still feels linear and confined. They could have added experience, attributes, 10x the weapons and gear, etc. characters have no personality.
Re: Community Wishlist for JA:F[message #336562] Sat, 11 October 2014 06:17 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Slax

 
Messages:1439
Registered:July 2006
Location: People riding polar bears...
http://i.imgur.com/ikKVntK.jpg
Beefcake!

Re: Community Wishlist for JA:F[message #336935] Tue, 21 October 2014 23:55 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Drglord

 
Messages:15
Registered:May 2013
So really after the supposed release of this horrible to watch and play game where do i put the sign of I TOLD YOU SO? I can here already the backers though saying well they will improve it more... right give them 10 more years i think they will pull through...
Re: Community Wishlist for JA:F[message #336947] Wed, 22 October 2014 00:53 Go to previous messageGo to previous message
Mauser

 
Messages:797
Registered:August 2006
Location: Bavaria - Germany
Dragonlord
So really after the supposed release of this horrible to watch and play game where do i put the sign of I TOLD YOU SO? I can here already the backers though saying well they will improve it more... right give them 10 more years i think they will pull through...


You're too hard on JA:F. It is by no means a "horrible" game in any regards. it just cannot live up to the expectations set in it by a diehard fanbase.

Right now, it is a decent, albeit flawed effort. A Game that has been released too early due to very tight budget constraints, which would have needed at least 6 more months of development and maybe a couple hundred thousands euros more to truly live up to its full potential.
This game barely met its already comparatively low Kickstarter goals, instead of being overfunded many times over, like other crowdfunded games, after all.

So everybody knew from the beginning it would be tight and in dire need of extensive community support and modding to become a proper JA game, to even come close to what 1.13 has achieved during a decade of development and polishing. We also always knew that it would never have the size of JA2.

At the very least it is more true to the originals than most of the turds with much bigger budgets that have been released under the JA franchise name in the past. And the core mechanics are solid, as is the engine - and hopefully the modding tools too.

What they most likely will be unable to improve though, is much of the content, especially the voice acting. The graphics aren't anything special, but they do the job and can still be improved a lot through dedicated community work. Same goes for the sound.

At the very least we got a somewhat solid, modern base from which can be worked and expanded. And if we give FC some more time (a few months, not years!) and hopefully some more funds through sales, they'll be able to improve the game to a point where it is actually somehwat enjoyable to play for someone used to 1.13 levels of sophistication.

☆★GL★☆
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