Home » MODDING HQ 1.13 » v1.13 Feature Requests » Different "breath" damage for different calibers
Different "breath" damage for different calibers[message #331385] Wed, 19 March 2014 15:21 Go to next message
Alex_SPB is currently offline Alex_SPB

 
Messages:169
Registered:February 2008
Location: Russia, St.Petersburg
What is the difference between 9mm and .45 ACP? .45 ACP is called a "Man Stopper" for a reason. Still many people especially in USA prefer an old trusty M1911 with 7+1 round capacity for the exceptional stopping power.

If there would be an optional .xml tag for each caliber ingame that defines the amount of breath damage attributed to each caliber then all the weapons in game might receive a new level of diversification.

For example an HK UMP 45 could become an incredible useful tool for close combat and there would be additional reasons to carry an M1911 over the series of different wonder nines.

If no tag is added to caliber then the default value is used.

I believe this small addition can add much diversity to the game and should be relatively easy to implement.

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Staff Sergeant
Re: Different "breath" damage for different calibers[message #331386] Wed, 19 March 2014 15:33 Go to previous messageGo to next message
DepressivesBrot is currently offline DepressivesBrot

 
Messages:3658
Registered:July 2009
People in the USA prefer their .45's because they believe the 1911 has been handed to them by God through his prophet John Browning. I see no reason to imbue it with any special powers beyond what its parameters say.

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Captain

Re: Different "breath" damage for different calibers[message #331389] Wed, 19 March 2014 15:49 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Alex_SPB is currently offline Alex_SPB

 
Messages:169
Registered:February 2008
Location: Russia, St.Petersburg
Well, my own experience of shooting 1911 tells me that this is one of the most comfortable gun to shoot due to the proper grip angle and slim single stack magazine. It just fits my hand way better then Beretta, Glock or Sig. No other magic then this.

As for other differences with 9mm is that penetration is better for 9mm bullet while the stopping power is significantly better for .45

And it is quite difficult to estimate a stopping power while plinking:)

[Updated on: Wed, 19 March 2014 15:57] by Moderator

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Staff Sergeant
Re: Different "breath" damage for different calibers[message #331400] Wed, 19 March 2014 19:44 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Gorro der Grüne is currently offline Gorro der Grüne

 
Messages:1448
Registered:March 2009
Location: Broadwurschd-City
9mm is not to stopp it's to kill

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Sergeant Major
Re: Different "breath" damage for different calibers[message #331401] Wed, 19 March 2014 21:39 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Anthropoid is currently offline Anthropoid

 
Messages:145
Registered:February 2014
There are a bunch of good online articles linked at the end of this wikipedia article on "stopping power."

What I gather is that, reality is far more complicated than the stereotype of ".45 is a manstopper, but 9mm is not."

What I have learned so far (and please correct me any of you guys who are true experts) incapacitating effects of gunshot wounds mostly depend on causing:
1. blood loss
2. damage to the central nervous system
3. damage to the heart (overlap with blood loss / loss of blood pressure I think)
4. (apparently, for reasons I don't quite get) damage to the liver
5. psychosomatic effects like pain, fear, etc.

So, if you are lucky to hit your target smack in the brain, spinal cord, heart, liver, then one shot might incapacitate within a few seconds. However, even a fatal wound to the heart may not incapacitate for as much as a minute.

While larger rounds naturally cause bigger holes, what I gather is that the real difference between a 9mm and a ~11.5mm (.45 inch) is not so much that fewer shots consistently lead to incapacitation with the larger round. I was reading a story here recently about a concealed carry civilian intervening in an assault on a police officer in the U.S. Some road rage whacko who had barged into a funeral procession got pulled over by a cop and was assaulting the cop. The cop was on his back getting beat to death by this maniac. The cop had already fired his handgun at least once and I think he had hit him too, but the bad guy had knocked the gun away or the magazine was empty or something.

So this concealed carry permit holder, who doesn't have his firearm on him, runs back to his truck to get his pistol, a .45 of some sort. Runs back and puts four shots into the assailants torso before he finally konks out.

In the famous 1986 Miami FBI shootout, these two serial bank robbers were both shot multiple times before they konked out. The shots that finally incapacitated them fully were headshots at pointblank range. One of them was hit fairly early in the gun fight by a lethal wound from a 9mm pistol at about 20 yards or more. It entered his chest on the right and cut his aorta. Nonetheless, he kept shooting officers (killing two of them) with his mini-14 for another two minutes or more. The wound was described by the coroner as "unsurvivable," meaning that even if they had him right on the operating table immediately after the wound, they doubt that he could've been saved. Nonetheless, he was able to function and kill for several minutes after receiving that "lethal" wound. Seems dubious to me that a .45 pistol would've incapacitated him any quicker than the 9mm did.

ADDIT: Oh and if any of you guys are keen to just discuss this sort of stuff in a more "off-topic" broad sense, I already started a thread a few days back in the off topic section on Firearms and the ArtScience of Shooting. Wink

[Updated on: Wed, 19 March 2014 21:50] by Moderator

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Sergeant
Re: Different "breath" damage for different calibers[message #331402] Wed, 19 March 2014 21:45 Go to previous message
DepressivesBrot is currently offline DepressivesBrot

 
Messages:3658
Registered:July 2009
TL;DR version of the above: Shot placement beats some mysterious stopping power any day.

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Captain

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