Home » MODDING HQ 1.13 » Flugente's Magika Workshop » New Feature: Dynamic opinions
Re: New Feature: Dynamic opinions[message #336687] Wed, 15 October 2014 01:12 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Flugente

 
Messages:3051
Registered:April 2009
Location: Germany
Fixed in r7570. It was actually an issue of the artillery functions - the ID on artillery shells was not set correctly. This caused all damage of an artillery strike to be attributed to the first merc. It just didn't occur until now, as there were no repercussions.


Re: New Feature: Dynamic opinions[message #337695] Wed, 12 November 2014 10:50 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Shinr

 
Messages:12
Registered:April 2012
Probably a minor oversight: Killing General Otto (the military boss in Alma) gives the opinion penalty even if he attacks you first, probably because he is classified as a civilian. In narrative he is a Pro-Deidranna asshole, so nobody should care.
Re: New Feature: Dynamic opinions[message #337696] Wed, 12 November 2014 13:02 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Flugente

 
Messages:3051
Registered:April 2009
Location: Germany
I think I had the same issue with regards to the Hicks clan. Not sure how I handled that, been away from that code part for a while, but it would be reasonable if mercs wouldn't complain about the death of civilians that are in active combat against them.

Not sure whether making it dependant on 'who shot first' would work easily though, as we do not keep track of that. Have to check in the evening.


Re: New Feature: Dynamic opinions[message #337699] Wed, 12 November 2014 16:20 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Wil473

 
Messages:2810
Registered:September 2004
Location: Canada
Would it be possible to define which civilian factions would be exempt from this feature? Urban Chaos has several near certain faction conflicts, and UC-1.13 only expands on the number of factions that are meant to go hostile.


Re: New Feature: Dynamic opinions[message #337704] Wed, 12 November 2014 23:08 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Flugente

 
Messages:3051
Registered:April 2009
Location: Germany
As of r7652, mercs will only complain about other mercs killing civilians if the civilian as non-hostile at the moment of their death.

This means that killing a member of any faction does not result in the opinion change if that person is hostile at the moment of his death. However, if they are neutral, this will cause the opinion-change - even if the faction goes hostile right afterwards.

Example: If you visit the Hicks while they are friendly and then, say, gun down a Hick with an auto-burst in realtime, this will cause other mercs to complain, as that guy was peacefully minding his own business. Once the battle has started however, they are fair game. Seems fair enough to me, chivalry on the battlefield will thus not cause negative feedback among your troops Smile

This does not require any faction-checks, so should work at any UC-faction etc..

Also note that the only mercs complaining about this are those considered 'good guys' in their profile (basically those that refuse to shoot civilians in the first place). If you really want to avoid this (and have a bit of evil role-playing), you could set up a dedicated death squad that has no problems with this :pitchfork:


Re: New Feature: Dynamic opinions[message #337718] Fri, 14 November 2014 00:30 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Kirill_OverK

 
Messages:263
Registered:September 2010
cool news !

thanks for big work !
Re: New Feature: Dynamic opinions[message #340392 is a reply to message #337718] Fri, 03 April 2015 18:45 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Flugente

 
Messages:3051
Registered:April 2009
Location: Germany
A few updates as of r7807 & GameDir r2233:
  • Fix: dynamic opinion events on finishing battle did not occur due to faulty sector coordinates
  • Fix: dynamic dialogue boxes were displayed with bad screen coordinates. This happened if a merc was talking simultaneously.
  • Change: dynamic dialogue is also written into tactical log
  • Change: in events that require a leader, any merc can be considered a leader, not just IMPs. The leader 'rating' is based on leadership, experience, and whether or not the merc has the squadleader trait and is an IMP. A a result, mercs will more often blame someone else for screwing up things, or praise the one most likely to be the 'commander' for victorious battles.
  • added a few new dynamic opinion events:
    • OPINIONEVENT_BESTCOMMANDEREVER - we won an important battle. Surely our leader's great strategy was a huge part of that...
    • OPINIONEVENT_BATTLE_SAVIOUR - someone saved our life: they killed an enemy that was attacking us, while we were wounded. In this case, 'wounded' means 'we had at least 10 hp missing unbandaged. This makes 'farming' this somewhat not easy. Friendship requires a blood sacrifice!
    • OPINIONEVENT_FRAGTHIEF - someone stole OUR kill. Dastardly fragfarmer! This server suxx! This event will be initated by 'arrogant' of 'showoff' character mercs.
    • OPINIONEVENT_BATTLE_ASSIST - someone took an enemy down with our assistance. We are such a good team.
    • OPINIONEVENT_BATTLE_TOOK_PRISONER - someone convinced the enemy to surrender. We like that, because we're not some insane psychopath. This event will be initiated by 'good guy' mercs, and those with a pacifist or intellectual character.
This batch of new events has the aim of making mercs that fight together 'interact' more with each other.



Saren threw his head back and screamed in impotent fury, before falling to his throne, head in his claws, trembling in horrified disbelief.

Then he heard a faint chime as Sovereign subscribed to her ECHO channel.

If you want, you can donate to me. This will not affect how and what I code, and I will not code specific features in return. I will be thankful though.


Re: New Feature: Dynamic opinions[message #340517 is a reply to message #340392] Sat, 11 April 2015 11:21 Go to previous messageGo to next message
navaroe

 
Messages:78
Registered:August 2012
Is the blame for retreat meant to be assigned to probable leader present in the sector where action takes place or probable leader anywhere? If it is in sector, then there is minor bug. In this saved game the active sector is D14,Drassen mine. A gopher squad is about to enter C11, find enemy and retreat. Raider, who is not even there (but is in Drassen mine sector) gets blamed for this shameful retreat. He's bit of an asshole all right, but this didn't seem fair to him happy

Saved game for build 7809 and options ini:
http://ulozto.net/xhL2QzRH/raidergetsblameforretreat-zip

[Updated on: Sat, 11 April 2015 11:22]

Re: New Feature: Dynamic opinions[message #340518 is a reply to message #340517] Sat, 11 April 2015 11:24 Go to previous messageGo to next message
navaroe

 
Messages:78
Registered:August 2012
pls delete

[Updated on: Sat, 11 April 2015 11:25]

Re: New Feature: Dynamic opinions[message #340603 is a reply to message #340518] Sun, 19 April 2015 13:35 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Flugente

 
Messages:3051
Registered:April 2009
Location: Germany
Update:
  • r7820: Change: dynamic opionion: mercs only complain about retreat if the enemy was aware of them - otherwise they assume it was a sneaky operation, which won't be punished. So entering a sector and then leaving again, without enemy contact, won't give you any complaints from this feature (you will still get the usual morale penalty though).
  • r7821: Change: the event OPINIONEVENT_BESTCOMMANDEREVER is only called if
    - we won the battle battle,
    - the enemy outnumbered us at least 2:1,
    - the enemy had at least 4 times our losses and
    - the enemy patrol numbered at least MAX_STRATEGIC_ENEMY_GROUP_SIZE people
    As this event gives a significant bonus, making it harder to get seems fair to me.
  • r7824: Fix: mercs no longer complain about civilians if you kill cows or crows.



Saren threw his head back and screamed in impotent fury, before falling to his throne, head in his claws, trembling in horrified disbelief.

Then he heard a faint chime as Sovereign subscribed to her ECHO channel.

If you want, you can donate to me. This will not affect how and what I code, and I will not code specific features in return. I will be thankful though.


Re: New Feature: Dynamic opinions[message #341117 is a reply to message #340603] Sat, 23 May 2015 17:10 Go to previous messageGo to next message
smeagol

 
Messages:2708
Registered:June 2008
Location: Bremen, Germany
A small request to improve user friendliness of the Melody site:

Would it be possible in pairwise comparison to add the option of using arrow keys to switch between mercs (maybe left+right key to toggle through left selected merc and up+down arrows to toggle through rright selected mercs)? Using the drag down menu is inconvenient, especially if comparing a big bunch of guys (and the drag down menus always interfere with the descriptions).



Re: New Feature: Dynamic opinions[message #341756 is a reply to message #341117] Wed, 15 July 2015 21:48 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Flugente

 
Messages:3051
Registered:April 2009
Location: Germany
As of r7919, specific events can be turned off by simply setting their modifier in Morale_Settings.ini to 0. This is useful if you want to play with this feature, but feel that a specific event is silly, or not required, or whatever.



Saren threw his head back and screamed in impotent fury, before falling to his throne, head in his claws, trembling in horrified disbelief.

Then he heard a faint chime as Sovereign subscribed to her ECHO channel.

If you want, you can donate to me. This will not affect how and what I code, and I will not code specific features in return. I will be thankful though.


Re: New Feature: Dynamic opinions[message #341759 is a reply to message #341756] Thu, 16 July 2015 02:59 Go to previous messageGo to next message
NewAgeOfPower

 
Messages:107
Registered:June 2010
Flugente, this feature is wundebar and adds greatly to my roleplaying experience, but what's the point? Do your guys get bonuses for being in a team where everyone likes each other dynamically?
Re: New Feature: Dynamic opinions[message #341763 is a reply to message #341759] Thu, 16 July 2015 13:55 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Flugente

 
Messages:3051
Registered:April 2009
Location: Germany
Apart from roleplaying, opinion on others alters mid/long-term morale. Morale alters a lot of things (you'll notice if you fight with a squad with low morale), and can even influence whether a merc will be willing to renew his/her contract.



Saren threw his head back and screamed in impotent fury, before falling to his throne, head in his claws, trembling in horrified disbelief.

Then he heard a faint chime as Sovereign subscribed to her ECHO channel.

If you want, you can donate to me. This will not affect how and what I code, and I will not code specific features in return. I will be thankful though.


Re: New Feature: Dynamic opinions[message #342211 is a reply to message #341763] Thu, 27 August 2015 05:34 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Franimus

 
Messages:41
Registered:June 2015
Location: USA
The message box in strategic view is unavailable while dynamic opinions are being shouted out. Then when it recovers, it's completely blank and I have to scroll up at least 1 line before I can see anything. Is that something fixable with how this feature was designed?
Re: New Feature: Dynamic opinions[message #342224 is a reply to message #342211] Thu, 27 August 2015 20:24 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Flugente

 
Messages:3051
Registered:April 2009
Location: Germany
That's somewhat independent of this feature. Several thousand revisions ago some code-change caused the text in this box to constantly appear and reappear on all kinds of actions (like refreshing dynamic dialogue boxes). I don't know what it is though, and have currently no time for that.



Saren threw his head back and screamed in impotent fury, before falling to his throne, head in his claws, trembling in horrified disbelief.

Then he heard a faint chime as Sovereign subscribed to her ECHO channel.

If you want, you can donate to me. This will not affect how and what I code, and I will not code specific features in return. I will be thankful though.


Re: New Feature: Dynamic opinions[message #342231 is a reply to message #342224] Fri, 28 August 2015 02:26 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Franimus

 
Messages:41
Registered:June 2015
Location: USA
Flugente wrote on Thu, 27 August 2015 13:24
That's somewhat independent of this feature. Several thousand revisions ago some code-change caused the text in this box to constantly appear and reappear on all kinds of actions (like refreshing dynamic dialogue boxes). I don't know what it is though, and have currently no time for that.

It sounds so scary when you say "several thousand revs ago" because it's possible suprised
Re: New Feature: Dynamic opinions[message #344813 is a reply to message #342231] Thu, 31 March 2016 03:50 Go to previous messageGo to next message
WilsonMG

 
Messages:28
Registered:October 2011
Location: USA
I just disabled Dynamic Opinions and Dynamic Dialogue because they were causing nothing but negative relationships over trivial/inconsequential things. I noticed after disabling Dynamic Opinions and then putting it back on that the previous values were retained in MeLoDY... While Dynamic Opinions is disabled, are these values still present, just hidden because you no longer have access to MeLoDY or are they removed entirely?

EDIT: After some experimentation I was able to leave Dynamic Opinions on and just cancel out the relationship modifiers I found annoying, thereby "fixing" my merc's relationships somewhat. It's a workable solution that has allowed me to continue on.

[Updated on: Thu, 31 March 2016 09:40]

Re: New Feature: Dynamic opinions[message #344814 is a reply to message #344813] Thu, 31 March 2016 13:07 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Flugente

 
Messages:3051
Registered:April 2009
Location: Germany
The opinion values are stored in variables on each merc. Disabling the feature causes them to be no longer used by the morale system, nor being displayed, but they ar still there. Thus reactivating the feature means they are used again.

If you deactivate the feature, morale should slowly go back to 'normal' (without dynamic opinions). It might take a bit, as morale cannot change instantly (outside of combat).



Saren threw his head back and screamed in impotent fury, before falling to his throne, head in his claws, trembling in horrified disbelief.

Then he heard a faint chime as Sovereign subscribed to her ECHO channel.

If you want, you can donate to me. This will not affect how and what I code, and I will not code specific features in return. I will be thankful though.


Re: New Feature: Dynamic opinions[message #344815 is a reply to message #344814] Thu, 31 March 2016 18:01 Go to previous messageGo to next message
WilsonMG

 
Messages:28
Registered:October 2011
Location: USA
Cool, that was what I was assuming/hoping. I ended up restarting my playthrough anyway as I'd made some other .ini tweaks and felt it would probably be best to start fresh. Thanks for the answer, Flugente!

If I had one suggestion for Dynamic Opinions, it would be to add in more positive events. I made some of the positive/negative values slightly higher knowing that only the positive would have an impact on my playstyle to balance out a lot of the base values, nationalism, racism, and sexism. As for Dynamic Dialogue, after looking through the .ini options for morale, I can honestly say I don't think much good can come from leaving it on. Unless you enjoy sorting out arguments and having a lot of drama. I prefer everyone just shuts the **** up and does the job they were paid for like the professionals they are supposed to be. ;)
Re: New Feature: Dynamic opinions[message #344821 is a reply to message #344815] Fri, 01 April 2016 00:38 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Flugente

 
Messages:3051
Registered:April 2009
Location: Germany
Yeah, I get that some events feel somewhat unncessary and somewhat silly ('frag-stealing' etc.). To be honest, I'm not totally content with some of the mechanics (like every event only happening once per day), but some limitations would have required more complicated code than I was feeling appropriate. As for the number of positive events - this feature was mostly born out of frustration that mercs were too damn happy all the time. Vanilla mercs team morale is like managing a bunch of Khorne berserkers - as long as you give them plenty of people to murder on a regular basis, they are as happy as a little girl on a pony farm. I'd actually like more negative events, but it 's not on my priority now.

Anyway, setting an event's modifier in Morale_Settings.INI to 0 stops that event from happening (not entirely sure you meant that, so there you go, in case you didn't).



Saren threw his head back and screamed in impotent fury, before falling to his throne, head in his claws, trembling in horrified disbelief.

Then he heard a faint chime as Sovereign subscribed to her ECHO channel.

If you want, you can donate to me. This will not affect how and what I code, and I will not code specific features in return. I will be thankful though.


Re: New Feature: Dynamic opinions[message #344822 is a reply to message #333461] Fri, 01 April 2016 02:06 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Faalagorn

 
Messages:157
Registered:February 2012
Location: Poland
Flugente wrote on Wed, 04 June 2014 02:02
Odd idea... the old GTA 1 (the very first one, where you saw everything top-down, couldn't save and died from one bullet) had this funny soundbite when using a telephone. Perhaps something like that? A simple sound that sounds like talking but can't be attributed to a single person.

Out of my head from the newer games that use this feature is Don't Starve. Also, Nintendo DSi had a feature to convert your recorded voice to similar effects used in Don't Starve.
Re: New Feature: Dynamic opinions[message #346464 is a reply to message #333259] Thu, 04 August 2016 06:03 Go to previous messageGo to next message
SchmittLenin

 
Messages:31
Registered:August 2015
Any way to make two (Or more) IMPs buddies? Could we mod in a trait or background effect giving good relations with some other traits/backgrounds? If so, any idea of how I'd do it?



Lurking is nice
Re: New Feature: Dynamic opinions[message #346492 is a reply to message #346464] Fri, 05 August 2016 21:32 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Flugente

 
Messages:3051
Registered:April 2009
Location: Germany
There are several slots in MercProfiles.xml for IMPs (PGMale, PGLady...). In that xml, friend relations are also set. When we create an IMP, we use one of these slots to write their data into. Note that after a game starts, MercProfiles.xml is stored in the savegame, editing the xml only affects a new game.

Thus what you could do is to set up the xml before you start the campaign by setting up possible friendships. Be warned though, unless you use a debugger you will not know for sure which IMP gets which slot.

The fact that we store the profile data in savegames is somewhat annoying. For some data it is perfectly reasonable (friend/hated relations are altered over time, stats grow over time...). For others it is very annoying (switching traits/personality/face anim coordinates/anything else requires a new campaign).

A good idea would be to create 2 xmls - one for data that is stored in savegame, one for data that is read purely from xml. Unfortunately, changing that would require significant savegame changes and require any modder to split their xmls too. Which is quite a hassle. Quite a few xmls have stupid things in there (like Ammotypes.xml) that we don't change for compatibility reasons.



Saren threw his head back and screamed in impotent fury, before falling to his throne, head in his claws, trembling in horrified disbelief.

Then he heard a faint chime as Sovereign subscribed to her ECHO channel.

If you want, you can donate to me. This will not affect how and what I code, and I will not code specific features in return. I will be thankful though.


Re: New Feature: Dynamic opinions[message #346610 is a reply to message #346492] Fri, 12 August 2016 11:03 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Elvis_A

 
Messages:250
Registered:December 2012
Location: exUSSR
Dynamo acts crazy. Complains about buddies flo/biff, wolf/fox etc
Afs mod
Re: New Feature: Dynamic opinions[message #346611 is a reply to message #346610] Fri, 12 August 2016 13:46 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Flugente

 
Messages:3051
Registered:April 2009
Location: Germany
Eh? The webpage or the dialogue (if active) should already give you a clue on what he is complaining about. If they offend him, well, he's going to complain. That's the entire idea of this.



Saren threw his head back and screamed in impotent fury, before falling to his throne, head in his claws, trembling in horrified disbelief.

Then he heard a faint chime as Sovereign subscribed to her ECHO channel.

If you want, you can donate to me. This will not affect how and what I code, and I will not code specific features in return. I will be thankful though.


Re: New Feature: Dynamic opinions[message #346620 is a reply to message #346611] Fri, 12 August 2016 21:26 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Elvis_A

 
Messages:250
Registered:December 2012
Location: exUSSR
Nope. He is alone in sector. Starts complaining about mentioned pairs
Re: New Feature: Dynamic opinions[message #346622 is a reply to message #346620] Fri, 12 August 2016 21:36 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Flugente

 
Messages:3051
Registered:April 2009
Location: Germany
Well, and what does he say exactly?



Saren threw his head back and screamed in impotent fury, before falling to his throne, head in his claws, trembling in horrified disbelief.

Then he heard a faint chime as Sovereign subscribed to her ECHO channel.

If you want, you can donate to me. This will not affect how and what I code, and I will not code specific features in return. I will be thankful though.


light45.png  Re: New Feature: Dynamic opinions[message #346623 is a reply to message #346622] Fri, 12 August 2016 23:08 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Elvis_A

 
Messages:250
Registered:December 2012
Location: exUSSR
note: AFS Mod

for example

http://i68.tinypic.com/34e486p.png


http://i65.tinypic.com/2aj88sn.png

[Updated on: Fri, 12 August 2016 23:14]

Re: New Feature: Dynamic opinions[message #346625 is a reply to message #346623] Fri, 12 August 2016 23:41 Go to previous message
Flugente

 
Messages:3051
Registered:April 2009
Location: Germany
Well. To quote the ini:
...
; someone else is friends with someone we really don't like
OPINIONEVENT_FRIENDSWITHHATED                 = -4
...

This event happens if merc A hates merc B a lot (opinion < -20) and merc C likes B a lot (> 20). In that case A will be pissed at C purely because they like B.
That seems to work just as intended.

If you don't like that particular event, simply set OPINIONEVENT_FRIENDSWITHHATED to 0 and it won't happen anymore (and won't count anymore either).



Saren threw his head back and screamed in impotent fury, before falling to his throne, head in his claws, trembling in horrified disbelief.

Then he heard a faint chime as Sovereign subscribed to her ECHO channel.

If you want, you can donate to me. This will not affect how and what I code, and I will not code specific features in return. I will be thankful though.


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