Home » PLAYER'S HQ 1.13 » v1.13 General Gameplay Talk » What the heck am I playing?
What the heck am I playing?[message #335469] Thu, 04 September 2014 20:37 Go to next message
Tyco

 
Messages:189
Registered:September 2001
Location: Be'er Sheva, Israel
I'm confused.

1.13 has an option to run a "vanilla JA2" but I swear some items there are from 1.13 proper, like camo helmets and different versions of camo paint. Also there are UB weapons on Bobby Ray's.

Speaking of B-Ray's, the selection is way too good for the first week of game time. There are frag and stun grenades on sale, as well as break lights, NV goggles (1st gen, which I know is a 1.13 item), and low-end SMGs.

Obviously this is related to the selections when starting a new game. So if I want to play as close a game as possible to Vanilla JA2, because I'm the sort of person who doesn't accept change in my entertainment easily, what are the selections I should go with?

While we're on the subject, can someone explain what all these options affect?
http://i239.photobucket.com/albums/ff157/Tyro972/selections.jpg

[Updated on: Thu, 04 September 2014 20:38] by Moderator

Re: What the heck am I playing?[message #335472] Thu, 04 September 2014 22:06 Go to previous messageGo to next message
grim

 
Messages:336
Registered:July 2006
Location: France
You may reduce BR quality and quantity to normal for a JA2 vanilla feeling.
What do you want from 1.13 if you want JA2 vanilla so much? Isn't 1.12 sufficent?
Tell us what you want to keep from 1.13 and maybe someone here can tell you how to disable the rest.
Re: What the heck am I playing?[message #335481] Thu, 04 September 2014 23:52 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Flugente

 
Messages:3461
Registered:April 2009
Location: Germany
Merc story backgrounds refers to this.

For vanilla style Bobby Rays I'd use the lowest settings in both cases. Item progress speed probably Normal.

While it isn't stated anywhere, it seems that at some point Reduced number of guns was intended to be just the vanilla ones - most new guns aren't allowed there (althoguh there are still ways to get them).


Re: What the heck am I playing?[message #335499] Fri, 05 September 2014 14:06 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Tyco

 
Messages:189
Registered:September 2001
Location: Be'er Sheva, Israel
Grim
What do you want from 1.13 if you want JA2 vanilla so much? Isn't 1.12 sufficent?


Clean JA2 1.12 is buggy on modern systems. Aside from always crashing when exiting (a nuisance more than it is a problem), sound constantly skips. 1.13 fixes a lot of these performance bugs, and there are plenty features in 1.13 that I do like.

The only thing I'm really missing in 1.13 is the classic JA2 IMP character generation, but I can just use JA2 for that and then "replicate" the results in the new generator.

Basically, what I would prefer is play the game as close as possible to original JA2 without changing the basic mechanics. This is why I play with old inventory and aiming systems.

@Flugente
Thanks for clearing that up. I personally think character backgrounds should be reflected in their normal stats, but its a very thorough and impressive mod nonetheless.
Re: What the heck am I playing?[message #335501] Fri, 05 September 2014 15:15 Go to previous messageGo to next message
grim

 
Messages:336
Registered:July 2006
Location: France
Concerning IMP creation, my memory is blurred, but wasn't there a way to use the old questionnary? There was another code to enter the site, giving different features, maybe that? Or was it, on the contrary, the way to avoid the questionnary at that time?
Re: What the heck am I playing?[message #335505] Fri, 05 September 2014 17:21 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Tyco

 
Messages:189
Registered:September 2001
Location: Be'er Sheva, Israel
One more thing I forgot to mention: when starting a new game, Drassen is full of regular soldiers and elites alongside a few admins. Soldiers also sometimes say admin lines.

Is this tied to INI settings that govern amount of troops the are converted to regulars and elites?
Re: What the heck am I playing?[message #335506] Fri, 05 September 2014 17:47 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Sargeno

 
Messages:71
Registered:December 2001
Location: Oregon, USA
Just my two cents:

Skill Traits = Old should give you the classic JA2 character creation screen but you also might not have any of the new skills like Scout or Radio Operator if used too.
Re: What the heck am I playing?[message #335507] Fri, 05 September 2014 18:39 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Scheinworld

 
Messages:922
Registered:December 2007
Location: Baltic Sea, Germany
Hello Tyco,

Tyco
Clean JA2 1.12 is buggy on modern systems. Aside from always crashing when exiting (a nuisance more than it is a problem), sound constantly skips. 1.13 fixes a lot of these performance bugs, and there are plenty features in 1.13 that I do like.

The only thing I'm really missing in 1.13 is the classic JA2 IMP character generation, but I can just use JA2 for that and then "replicate" the results in the new generator.

Basically, what I would prefer is play the game as close as possible to original JA2 without changing the basic mechanics. This is why I play with old inventory and aiming systems.


My first thought as I've seen your post was: "JA2-Stracciatella Continued" (by Gennady) including many bug fixes and High resolutions support.

Maybe you (or another one) would like to take a look in the future? Wink


Best regards; Schein


Re: What the heck am I playing?[message #335592] Sun, 07 September 2014 14:39 Go to previous messageGo to next message
bismuthdrummer

 
Messages:18
Registered:August 2009
Location: North Dakota, USA

Stracciatella, while an excellent piece of work, isn't as stable as 1.13. I've played the latest stable and had rather strange things (though not fatal) happen that don't in 1.12/1.13.

I think the initial game settings could use a makeover, there are too many obscure options for new/returning fans to slog through. I had to quit (since I couldn't Alt-Tab) and scour the forums for answers just to start a new game. Either help text or an Advanced button (or both) would be adequate, though I believe only the difficulty, game style, and arsenal need to appear on that screen as the various system/progression options aren't as likely to change once the user is satisfied. Just my opinion.
Re: What the heck am I playing?[message #335634] Mon, 08 September 2014 15:27 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Tyco

 
Messages:189
Registered:September 2001
Location: Be'er Sheva, Israel
The help text in the ini editor could certainly use some polishing. They may be fine for the modders who worked on it but new modders and players will find the explanations unpenetrable (like me).

I'm also certain something in the ini changes the way the AI positions forces at the start of the game (see above), but I have no idea what might it be. Twice in the same game I encountered admin patrols outside of Drassen, while the town itself had all three varieties of soldiers in it.

I agree with bismuthdrummer that, generally, the less in-game options to tweak the better. Things like B-Ray's quality and availability, new/old inventory and aiming and interrupt systems are more suited for ini editing, I feel.

Also in the new IMP generator, in the character section, some tooltips on what the different options (sexist, gentleman, asshole, etc.) MIGHT entail for your merc and his/her relations to other mercs would be very useful.
Re: What the heck am I playing?[message #335635] Mon, 08 September 2014 17:27 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Scheinworld

 
Messages:922
Registered:December 2007
Location: Baltic Sea, Germany
Hi,

bismuthdrummer
Stracciatella, while an excellent piece of work, isn't as stable as 1.13. I've played the latest stable and had rather strange things (though not fatal) happen that don't in 1.12/1.13.


@bismuthdrummer: What do you mean with 'latest stable' relating to Stracciatella (old "Walnut" release?). Well, if so there are newer builds than that like the mentioned "Continued" project by Gennady or other "stable" builds like these one for Windows users:
http://kermi.pp.fi/JA_2/Stracciatella/Releases/Updates/Windows/

If you have found any bugs in Stracciatella just report them! I'm sure the developers are happy to get feedback and can fix your problems eventually.


My personal (Stracciatella) playing favourite is based on Stracciatella r7059 including Mythrell's 800x600 Mod v0.04b (for Windows users as well!):
http://kermi.pp.fi/JA_2/Stracciatella/Mods/800x600Mod/v0.04/


Tyco
I agree with bismuthdrummer that, generally, the less in-game options to tweak the better. Things like B-Ray's quality and availability, new/old inventory and aiming and interrupt systems are more suited for ini editing, I feel.


@Tyco: I don't think so. These (important) game settings belong to the options screen of (new) 1.13 versions and should not belong to the incredibly long Ja2_Options.ini file where most players would probably miss them.

In some cases I want to mod/play with JA2 vanilla builds and sometimes I prefer different 1.13 versions, but v1.13 shouldn't try to be or imitate original JA2 vanilla, because it isn't and that's probably the reason why so many players want to play it. My opinion.


Best regards; Schein


Re: What the heck am I playing?[message #335669] Wed, 10 September 2014 04:35 Go to previous messageGo to next message
bismuthdrummer

 
Messages:18
Registered:August 2009
Location: North Dakota, USA

@Scheinworld
Yep, I am aware of Gennady's work on Stracciatella. I'm on version 0.12.352, released as of May 1st this year. I haven't reported anything because I was just trying that version out and didn't have time to troubleshoot.

The bugs I encountered were minor (one was a result of me blowing up everyone in the rebel basement), and 1.13 is not bug-free by any means. But moving to Stracciatella just translates the performance problems that have been mitigated in 1.13 into game world problems in less-tested waters.

With regards to the initial settings screen, it's obviously designed for modders/tinkerers. I think it's a fair assumption that most players will settle on the majority of those options and won't want to see them every new game. Even tinkerers like to save their settings, and that's not possible with this interface.

It's not a matter of imitation but a matter of good game design. The settings screen is like your homepage on a website; it sees the most traffic by a country mile. At the very least you can hide the advanced options using an Advanced button, this alone will eliminate confusion by implicitly telling a new user the options they need to worry about (difficulty) versus options they don't (New Chance to Hit system). Every well-designed game has a proper learning curve, and presenting those options to someone who just picked the game up or someone who hasn't played in 5 years is like asking an Algebra student whether they'll like Calculus or not.

However, if the attitude prevails that 1.13 should not be accessible to new and returning JA2 players, then nevermind. It's not on my agenda to change the mind of the coders, only to offer input.
Re: What the heck am I playing?[message #335671] Wed, 10 September 2014 10:31 Go to previous messageGo to next message
JMich

 
Messages:569
Registered:January 2011
Location: Greece
bismuthdrummer
Even tinkerers like to save their settings, and that's not possible with this interface.
User profile folder, Ja2_Settings.ini for the options screen, Ja2_sp.ini for the New Game screen. There's also the Ja2_mp.ini for the multiplayer options.
Re: What the heck am I playing?[message #335676] Wed, 10 September 2014 18:34 Go to previous message
Scheinworld

 
Messages:922
Registered:December 2007
Location: Baltic Sea, Germany
Hi,

bismuthdrummer
Yep, I am aware of Gennady's work on Stracciatella. I'm on version 0.12.352, released as of May 1st this year.


@bismuthdrummer: Yes, that is the latest version by Gennady.

Thank you for your opinion/explanation regarding initial game settings screen! Now I understand what you had in mind or rather what you are worrying about.


@JMich: Thank you for your post too! Didn't you build a nice OptionsScreen patch in the past?

http://www.ja-galaxy-forum.com/ubbthreads.php/topics/287561/#Post308881

I always thought this is a useful patch and maybe it could be even used as solution for the problem(s) bismuthdrummer described above? Why it wasn't implemented (in this or another form) into v1.13 yet?


Best regards; Schein


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