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Laser Aiming Modules - A Use?[message #340114]

Tue, 17 March 2015 18:23

KyBaby

Messages:9
Registered:February 2015
Location: United States

Aside from the small Laser Sight, all of the LAMs have debilitating camouflage modifiers that seem to preclude their use. Is there a good way to use these? Do the stats under the "Advanced" tab overstate their drawbacks? And, out of curiosity, why is the small Laser Sight exempt from these penalties?

Additionally, I noticed that all of the LAMs (except for the Laser Sight) affect the Stealth Modifier. The description of the Stealth Modifier states that it refers to the enemy's ability to hear, not see, the merc. Having admittedly only used a LAM once IRL (and it was Eotech), I have never noticed any noise from the module. Are LAMs generally louder, or are the modders changing the application of the Stealth Modifier?

Thanks for the help!

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Re: Laser Aiming Modules - A Use?[message #340117 is a reply to message #340114]

Tue, 17 March 2015 20:41

silversurfer

Messages:2791
Registered:May 2009

The small laser sight was probably excluded because it is a vanilla item and nobody bothered to update it. If you ask me it should have a small penalty (-2 for example) and the Rifle LAM should get a higher penalty of -15 (instead of -5) which would match the Rifle LAM Flashlight Combo.
Also weapons with integrated lasers should get the same penalty as the corresponding laser item.

Laser provide a bonus to chance to hit as long as they are used within their designated range (and somewhat beyond).

Stealth is more or less the ability to remain undetected by staying in the dark and moving silently. Using a laser pointer doesn't help with that.

[Updated on: Tue, 17 March 2015 20:43]

Wildfire Maps Mod 6.07 on SVN: https://ja2svn.mooo.com/source/ja2/branches/Wanne/JA2%201.13%20Wildfire%206.06%20-%20Maps%20MOD

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Re: Laser Aiming Modules - A Use?[message #340120 is a reply to message #340117]

Wed, 18 March 2015 02:19

KyBaby

Messages:9
Registered:February 2015
Location: United States

Thanks for the info! The changes that you suggest make sense. I would give the Laser Sight a -5 penalty at least (if the Rifle LAM was bumped to -15) to keep it more in line with the other modules. Not that this is a suggestion thread, but it would be really nice if the modders balanced the LAMs and clarified that the Stealth Modifier is about more than just sound.

A big remaining question is whether or not the pros of the LAMs outweigh the cons. Frankly, I think that the answer is no (with the current exception of the Laser Sight). I'm not really sure how to solve this actually. This is getting beyond my IRL experience, but the 100-130m maximum seems pretty realistic. Yes, many LAMs can place a dot further than that, but at that distance, you're probably better served with an optic anyway. Maybe they would work better on the large maps of AIMNAS (I haven't tried it), but in 1.13...

Thoughts?

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Re: Laser Aiming Modules - A Use?[message #340124 is a reply to message #340120]

Wed, 18 March 2015 10:01

silversurfer

Messages:2791
Registered:May 2009

In NCTH the laser bonus differs depending on the type of sight used. You have to decide yourself if you want to sacrifice some camouflage for better CTH. I use lasers when available. The camo penalty can be overcome with the lots of camo attachments.

Wildfire Maps Mod 6.07 on SVN: https://ja2svn.mooo.com/source/ja2/branches/Wanne/JA2%201.13%20Wildfire%206.06%20-%20Maps%20MOD

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Re: Laser Aiming Modules - A Use?[message #340128 is a reply to message #340124]

Wed, 18 March 2015 18:44

silversurfer

Messages:2791
Registered:May 2009

I just updated items.xml in GameDir 2229 with proper values for laser camo penalties. These also apply to guns with built-in lasers.

100 tiles laser range is the base with a penalty of 5. After that we have entries with:
120 tiles = 6 penalty
130 tiles = 6 penalty
140 tiles = 7 penalty
300 tiles = 15 penalty
400 tiles = 20 penalty

There are no other lasers in default 1.13 GameDir.

I also updated the code in r7789 to better display camo values. Now only the highest camo value is displayed in the characters camo box instead of a sum of all camo values. This fixes a problem that a laser will drown the camo display and produce wrong results. Also it's not possible anymore to wear negative camo. It just didn't make sense. Otherwise a merc with a white shirt should have had a built-in camo penalty... cheeky

For example if you have 30 woodland, 10 urban and 3 desert camo and use a small laser pointer (-5 bonus) you will have final values of:
25 woodland
5 urban
0 desert

The character camo box will display 25 (highest camo value) instead of 23 as before (30+10+3 - the laser penalty of 4*5).

Wildfire Maps Mod 6.07 on SVN: https://ja2svn.mooo.com/source/ja2/branches/Wanne/JA2%201.13%20Wildfire%206.06%20-%20Maps%20MOD

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