Home » PLAYER'S HQ 1.13 » v1.13 General Gameplay Talk » Help with camo
Help with camo[message #352709] Tue, 20 March 2018 05:08 Go to next message
Scalphunter

 
Messages:17
Registered:March 2017
I have a mercenary who has a base camo of 50% (Helmet cover, camo undershirt, flecktarn vest, zylon pants) on whom, whenever I use a camo kit, the camo percentage never goes to 100%. This is happening for all mercenaries regardless of base camo. Also, the type of camo used seems to have no effect on the mercenary's camo color, so even if I use urban camo, the merc apperas green in the tactical view. The protrait shows the correct camo type.

Speaking of camo portraits, Shadow's portrait does not have the camo it's supposed to have.

Any idea why these might be happening?

I'm using Rev 8517 GameDir 2400.

[Updated on: Tue, 20 March 2018 05:09]

Re: Help with camo[message #352711 is a reply to message #352709] Tue, 20 March 2018 10:39 Go to previous messageGo to next message
DepressivesBrot

 
Messages:3804
Registered:July 2009
Camo kits in recent versions default to only painting the face and hands of a merc, which accounts for about 15% of their surface iirc.



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Re: Help with camo[message #352712 is a reply to message #352711] Tue, 20 March 2018 12:25 Go to previous messageGo to next message
townltu

 
Messages:177
Registered:December 2017
Location: here
Shadows portrait should show camo if you use a camo kit on him, unless that was changed since r8517,
else something may be wrong with your install if you did not touch the .ini file.

Mercs will only show up as camoed on tactical map if their camo value is 50% or higher,
again unless changed since r8517.


camo_kit_usable_area is set to 5 in ja2Options.ini since long,
which imo pushes camo "balance" too much to lbe/ghillie,
i usually set it to 15 - 25 depending on base camo values&other game/mod conditions.
Re: Help with camo[message #352714 is a reply to message #352709] Tue, 20 March 2018 14:36 Go to previous messageGo to next message
silversurfer

 
Messages:2292
Registered:May 2009
CAMO_KIT_USABLE_AREA in Ja2_Options.ini defines how much of the body can be covered by a camo kit (default face and hands only).

The merc's camo color doesn't change because there are no graphics for other camo than woodland.

Shadow only has a permanent camo portrait if you are playing with old traits as there is no "camouflage" in new traits.



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Re: Help with camo[message #352717 is a reply to message #352714] Tue, 20 March 2018 18:56 Go to previous messageGo to next message
DepressivesBrot

 
Messages:3804
Registered:July 2009
silversurfer wrote on Tue, 20 March 2018 13:36
The merc's camo color doesn't change because there are no graphics for other camo than woodland.
There are, it's just harder to get urban or desert to be the majority in Vanilla. With AIMNAS' alternative camo uniforms e.g., there's brown-ish and black-ish people running all over the place.



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Re: Help with camo[message #352721 is a reply to message #352717] Tue, 20 March 2018 23:03 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Scalphunter

 
Messages:17
Registered:March 2017
Thanks for the responses. If I increase CAMO_KIT_USABLE_AREA to 15 and apply camo to my 50 base camo merc, will the total camo be 65%? Is there no way to get 100% camo? Also, the base camo we get from the lbe seems to be woodland camo. Does that make the base camo ineffective in urban environments?

Since I see brown(desert camo) and gray(urban camo) enemy units in the tactical view, would it be possible to have our mercs show those colors?

I am playing with the new traits, which explains why Shadow isn't permanently camouflaged.

townltu wrote on Tue, 20 March 2018 06:25
Mercs will only show up as camoed on tactical map if their camo value is 50% or higher,
again unless changed since r8517.


I have some mercs who are at 43% base camo who appear camouflaged without using extra camo kits.

[Updated on: Tue, 20 March 2018 23:07]

Re: Help with camo[message #352722 is a reply to message #352721] Tue, 20 March 2018 23:22 Go to previous messageGo to next message
bigalmoho

 
Messages:37
Registered:January 2016
Scalphunter wrote on Tue, 20 March 2018 17:03
Thanks for the responses. If I increase CAMO_KIT_USABLE_AREA to 15 and apply camo to my 50 base camo merc, will the total camo be 65%? Is there no way to get 100% camo? Also, the base camo we get from the lbe seems to be woodland camo. Does that make the base camo ineffective in urban environments?

Since I see brown(desert camo) and gray(urban camo) enemy units in the tactical view, would it be possible to have our mercs show those colors?

I am playing with the new traits, which explains why Shadow isn't permanently camouflaged.

townltu wrote on Tue, 20 March 2018 06:25
Mercs will only show up as camoed on tactical map if their camo value is 50% or higher,
again unless changed since r8517.


I have some mercs who are at 43% base camo who appear camouflaged without using extra camo kits.



It seems to me, that when wearing all three pieces of the ghillie suit, I had 100% camo, even without face camo...
Re: Help with camo[message #352727 is a reply to message #352722] Wed, 21 March 2018 12:25 Go to previous messageGo to next message
silversurfer

 
Messages:2292
Registered:May 2009
You need to "mouseover" the camo value to see the details. The camo value only displays the highest value but if you have for example 45% woodland + 8% urban your merc will have a wood camouflage appearance in tactical because 45 + 8 is greater than 50.

Unless you are using a modified exe or modified Ini settings you cannot reach 100% camo without camo kits because the game automatically calculates the max LBE camo value from 100 - CAMO_KIT_USABLE_AREA. So with the default CAMO_KIT_USABLE_AREA of 5 your LBE camo can only ever reach 95 which is still very high.

@Depri
Thanks for the info. You are right, I just never got other forms of camo high enough to display urban or other camo colors.



Wildfire Maps Mod 6.07 on SVN: https://ja2svn.mooo.com/source/ja2/branches/Wanne/JA2%201.13%20Wildfire%206.06%20-%20Maps%20MOD

Re: Help with camo[message #352728 is a reply to message #352727] Wed, 21 March 2018 23:31 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Scalphunter

 
Messages:17
Registered:March 2017
silversurfer wrote on Wed, 21 March 2018 06:25
You need to "mouseover" the camo value to see the details. The camo value only displays the highest value but if you have for example 45% woodland + 8% urban your merc will have a wood camouflage appearance in tactical because 45 + 8 is greater than 50.

Unless you are using a modified exe or modified Ini settings you cannot reach 100% camo without camo kits because the game automatically calculates the max LBE camo value from 100 - CAMO_KIT_USABLE_AREA. So with the default CAMO_KIT_USABLE_AREA of 5 your LBE camo can only ever reach 95 which is still very high.

@Depri
Thanks for the info. You are right, I just never got other forms of camo high enough to display urban or other camo colors.


Okay. So this is what's happening to me. On my 50% camo merc, the 50% is from the varios LBEs. When I use a woodland camo kit on him, the camo goes up to 55%. If I try to use the kit again, I can't.

When I hover over the camo information, I see the following:
5/50% Woodland camo
0/10% Desert camo.

If I use a desert camo kit, the overall camo stays at 50% but this is what I see when I hover:
0/50% Woodland camo
5/10% Desert camo.

I understand that the 5% is added because CAMO_KIT_USABLE_AREA = 5. But it seems impossible to reach 100% camo using the kit.

I tried an experiment. I change the CAMO_KIT_USABLE_AREA to 60, so the base camo from LBE would be a max of 40, which would be woodland since all LBEs seem to give only woodland camo. I took off all the equipment which was giving me a camo boost so that the base camo was 0%. Then, I used woodland/deser/urban kits which correctly gave me a 60% camo coverage. Depending on the kit used, I now see the correct color on the merc. However, when I then wear the LBEs, the values seem to not add up correctly. With 60 woodland camo with the kit and then wearing the TT Assault(20%) and Zylon pants(12%), the total camo should be 92%, but I only get 88%. I don't have any Lasers or Rifle LAMs which woould reduce the camo.

Also, it seems that woodland camo gets a boost because, as far as I know, no LBEs give you desert or urban camo. So the max of either of these I can achieve with a kit would be 60%.

[Updated on: Wed, 21 March 2018 23:34]

Re: Help with camo[message #352731 is a reply to message #352728] Thu, 22 March 2018 11:19 Go to previous messageGo to next message
silversurfer

 
Messages:2292
Registered:May 2009
I used Gasket for your experiment and I get the 92% woodland camo as expected (60 from wood camo kit + 20 from Tac 1A Vest + 12 from Zylon Pants). Your test merc must have had some penalty on him.

Btw. there are LBE that grant non-woodland camo. Especially the MOLLE items are available in different camo colors.



Wildfire Maps Mod 6.07 on SVN: https://ja2svn.mooo.com/source/ja2/branches/Wanne/JA2%201.13%20Wildfire%206.06%20-%20Maps%20MOD

Re: Help with camo[message #352733 is a reply to message #352731] Thu, 22 March 2018 11:57 Go to previous messageGo to next message
townltu

 
Messages:177
Registered:December 2017
Location: here
Quote:
...
However, when I then wear the LBEs, the values seem to not add up correctly. With 60 woodland camo with the kit and then wearing the TT Assault(20%) and Zylon pants(12%), the total camo should be 92%, but I only get 88%. I don't have any Lasers or Rifle LAMs which woould reduce the camo.
...
Perhaps your merc was wearing a leg rig which has no camo and thus partially negates the zylon pants?
Torso armour and lbe may also effect each other.
Re: Help with camo[message #352739 is a reply to message #352733] Fri, 23 March 2018 00:37 Go to previous messageGo to next message
MeganD

 
Messages:11
Registered:March 2018
townltu wrote on Thu, 22 March 2018 11:57
Torso armour and lbe may also effect each other.

I think this is the case; while wearing the early-game red ghillie suit, switching from an LBE with 10% to one with 20%, my overall camo goes up by 5%, not 10% (all woodland).

[Updated on: Fri, 23 March 2018 00:37]

Re: Help with camo[message #352740 is a reply to message #352733] Fri, 23 March 2018 02:17 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Scalphunter

 
Messages:17
Registered:March 2017
silversurfer wrote on Thu, 22 March 2018 05:19

Btw. there are LBE that grant non-woodland camo. Especially the MOLLE items are available in different camo colors.


I did not know this. Thanks!

townltu wrote on Thu, 22 March 2018 05:57

Perhaps your merc was wearing a leg rig which has no camo and thus partially negates the zylon pants?
Torso armour and lbe may also effect each other.


I was wearing the Dyneema armor with the LBE. As far as the leg rig goes, I was wearing an SMG holster.

In any case, I updated to the latest unstable version and started a new game. I'll try you guys' suggestions out when the coolness level allows it.
Re: Help with camo[message #352746 is a reply to message #352740] Fri, 23 March 2018 09:35 Go to previous message
silversurfer

 
Messages:2292
Registered:May 2009
LBE over armor is a good point. There are two modifiers in Item_Settings.ini.

CAMO_LBE_OVER_VEST_MODIFIER
CAMO_LBE_OVER_PANTS_MODIFIER



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