Home » SIRTECH CLASSICS » Jagged Alliance: Unfinished Business » Vanilla Modding » The perfect Jagged Alliance
The perfect Jagged Alliance[message #100791] Thu, 18 March 2004 01:13 Go to next message
Dante

 
Messages:8
Registered:March 2004
Location: South European Union
Graphic enhancements:

-> 1024*768 32 bit colour
-> New hi resolution textures (ground, buildings, objects, mercs, npcs etc)
-> New interface

Game enhancemens:

-> Ability to lean over corners, using corners as protection, so you could shoot whilst not exposing yourself much.
-> Ability to press your back into corners, to avoid exposure.
-> Ability to climb trees.
-> Individual objects for every weapon. All the weapons would have different graphics so the ak wouldn't look like the m4, glock wouldn't look like desert eagle and mp5k wouldn't look like a normal handgun.
-> The mercenaries models would have a helmet and a vest ( as it is the mercenary models have a bare head and a tshirt, this has to be changed so the mercs models would have a helmet and a vest, they would start the game with a kevlar vest and kevlar helmet, think about it it makes sense...)
-> When you change helmet, vest, the color of the vest and helmet on the merc changes


please add to the list.
Re: The perfect Jagged Alliance[message #100792] Thu, 18 March 2004 01:23 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Shanga

 
Messages:3525
Registered:January 2000
Location: Danubia
- 1024x768 is done alreay. We're just refining it a bit.
- Hi-res is a bit more complicated. We either change the whole graphics engine in order to ignore the STI files and use regular bitmaps or PCX, or we change the STI files to a higher pallete (no way, Jose... not in a million years!)
- a new interface is been worked on.


Re: The perfect Jagged Alliance[message #100793] Thu, 18 March 2004 03:07 Go to previous messageGo to next message
KIA

 
Messages:93
Registered:November 2002
Location: Virginia (USA)
*cracking knuckles and chortling in an evil fashion* Reeeeaaaallllyyyy??? 1024x768. New interface. Muahahaha!!!! Now we're cooking!!!
Re: The perfect Jagged Alliance[message #100794] Thu, 18 March 2004 04:16 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Digicrab

 
Messages:254
Registered:December 2003

Re: New hi resolution textures

JA2 is not a 3D game, the tiles are as hi-res as they need to be. You can't zoom in, therefore you can't lose detail.

Re:
Quote:
-> Ability to lean over corners, using corners as protection, so you could shoot whilst not exposing yourself much.
-> Ability to press your back into corners, to avoid exposure.
-> Ability to climb trees.
-> Individual objects for every weapon. All the weapons would have different graphics so the ak wouldn't look like the m4, glock wouldn't look like desert eagle and mp5k wouldn't look like a normal handgun.
-> The mercenaries models would have a helmet and a vest ( as it is the mercenary models have a bare head and a tshirt, this has to be changed so the mercs models would have a helmet and a vest, they would start the game with a kevlar vest and kevlar helmet, think about it it makes sense...)
-> When you change helmet, vest, the color of the vest and helmet on the merc changes
I don't see this happening any time soon. This will either require new animations (+code for them) or is altogether impossble within the current engine. The only way this is happening is if we rewrite the engine.
Re: The perfect Jagged Alliance[message #100795] Thu, 18 March 2004 05:50 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Dante

 
Messages:8
Registered:March 2004
Location: South European Union
yeah, your right I'm just used to fps. In truecombat we increased the texture resolution and everything looked way better, anyway, what I meant to say is just picture ja2 with the graphic quality of diablo2 or even fallout2. I think they both use 32 bit color. I guess that is just daydreamin

"I don't see this happening any time soon. This will either require new animations (+code for them) or is altogether impossible within the current engine."

but wait is it possible for you to edit the weapon and merc models without changing their animations??? Like just pic a model, for instance shadow, and draw a little helmet and a kevlar on it?
Re: The perfect Jagged Alliance[message #100796] Thu, 18 March 2004 06:49 Go to previous messageGo to next message
TrailBlazer

 
Messages:511
Registered:September 2001
Location: Athens, Greece

Models? What are models? Like Cindy Crawford?
Re: The perfect Jagged Alliance[message #100797] Thu, 18 March 2004 07:35 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Shanga

 
Messages:3525
Registered:January 2000
Location: Danubia
They JA2 bodies are frame-by-frame renders from a 3d program, put together in an animated STI file.

A good 3D modeller can create new body types and I've seen the source code where these are defined, so yes, we can add new movements. But that doesn't mean that "leaning over corners" will actually work, unless someone writes a whole new section in the code to tell the game what that means.


Re: The perfect Jagged Alliance[message #100798] Thu, 18 March 2004 07:47 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Kaerar

 
Messages:2050
Registered:January 2003
Location: Australia :D
Quote:
just picture ja2 with the graphic quality of diablo2 or even fallout2. I think they both use 32 bit color.
I think you need to check your sources! Fallout 2 in just as 256 colour as JA2 (Believe me I've ripped the images out of it and they aren't pretty!) But the revamp it got for Tactics made it 32bit or at the very least 16bit.

Quote:
is it possible for you to edit the weapon and merc models without changing their animations??? Like just pic a model, for instance shadow, and draw a little helmet and a kevlar on it?
Well I think too much UT or Quake 3 here! JA2 uses a series of still images (animations) for ALL actions the mercs. If it had a 3D engine maybe, but not for the last 6-7yrs! Having said that I'd like to see Armour affect the look of your merc so you can have a little more personality to your merc. Only problem is at the moment you'd have to make all the various animations again but the combinations would take ages to do and add a lot of size to the original game!

@Shanga - Thanks about the quotes! Would PCX or BMP be a viable alternative to STI? If yes I'm all for it!


Re: The perfect Jagged Alliance[message #100799] Thu, 18 March 2004 09:22 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Shanga

 
Messages:3525
Registered:January 2000
Location: Danubia
Question is: how do you make an animation without STI? With Gif Animator?


Re: The perfect Jagged Alliance[message #100800] Thu, 18 March 2004 16:40 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Kaerar

 
Messages:2050
Registered:January 2003
Location: Australia :D
Gif's suffer the same problem as STI's which is 256 colour.

Can PCX files be animated? or maybe ask if any of the original squad had the idea of updating the STI format to take 16/32bit colour?

Can GIF's be done in 16/32bit colour?


Re: The perfect Jagged Alliance[message #100801] Thu, 18 March 2004 17:26 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Headshot

 
Messages:176
Registered:May 2002
Location: Los Angeles ( Hollywood )...

A GIF,BMP,PCX all can be animated and can be done with a C++ library that is free and OPEN SOURCE.

Look here for info http://www.chilkatsoft.com/ChilkatDx/ChilkatDx.asp

Give it a thought.

Headshot
Re: The perfect Jagged Alliance[message #100802] Thu, 18 March 2004 21:40 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Shanga

 
Messages:3525
Registered:January 2000
Location: Danubia
Isn't that a DX9 lib?

So first we need to budge JA2 from its old DX5 libs. And I'm afraid that's quite a task, since dear MS changed a lot between DX5 and DX9.


Re: The perfect Jagged Alliance[message #100803] Thu, 18 March 2004 21:40 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Dante

 
Messages:8
Registered:March 2004
Location: South European Union
"They JA2 bodies are frame-by-frame renders from a 3d program, put together in an animated STI file. A good 3D modeller can create new body types and I've seen the source code where these are defined"

So the idea of having your mercenaries models/bodies with a helmet and vest is possible but it would just extremely dificult not to mention tedious and hardwork for you guys Sad

anyway about the 1024*768 .ini file, would I be able to beta test it?
I have 2 laptops, a hp compaq with ati radeon and a dell with nvidia, and a desktop with geforce 5200.
I play ja2 on my laptops but if I don't stretch the image to fit it just shows up in a tiny tiny screen, that's why I need 1024*768 Sad so if u guys wanna send it -> swat@planetquake.com
Re: The perfect Jagged Alliance[message #100804] Thu, 18 March 2004 21:52 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Shanga

 
Messages:3525
Registered:January 2000
Location: Danubia
It will be released with the JA2 Platinium pack we are preparing right now.


Re: The perfect Jagged Alliance[message #100805] Thu, 18 March 2004 21:59 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Dante

 
Messages:8
Registered:March 2004
Location: South European Union
Shanga If I download the ja2 platinum pack can I extract the resolution file and use only that?

I only play urban chaos now and will not be installing jagged alliance 2 anytime soon
Re: The perfect Jagged Alliance[message #100806] Thu, 18 March 2004 22:32 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Shanga

 
Messages:3525
Registered:January 2000
Location: Danubia
Nope. You will be able to play a regular JA2 game though. Using the Platinium exe will screw up UC.

The JA2 Platinium is just a demonstration of what can be done. Not an actual mod. Look at it as a "Chinese to English translation". Very Happy


Re: The perfect Jagged Alliance[message #100807] Thu, 18 March 2004 23:52 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Dante

 
Messages:8
Registered:March 2004
Location: South European Union
Sad Sad Sad

any chance of just the 1024*768 .ini so we can play urban chaos with better resolution?
Re: The perfect Jagged Alliance[message #100808] Fri, 19 March 2004 00:49 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Shanga

 
Messages:3525
Registered:January 2000
Location: Danubia
The INI is worthless without the Platinium exe. The JA2UC.EXE won't use it because it's still the old engine. Plus, the Platinium exe is JA2 Gold version. JA2UC is 1.07.

Now, in the long run, maybe we'll update JA2UC to run on Platinium, but it's way too early.

You can manually make JA2UC to run, but you'll get every single item screwed up. The old "I have a shovel in my hand and i can shoot 9mm with it" issue...

The 1024x768 resolution is not finished 100% too. Joker_Pl made the tactical map load at that res. We still need to make new graphics for the laptop and the rest of the game. Or re-adjust the old ones in the proper position.

Did you REALLY expect to have a mod ready in less than a week?! No way, it would've made MODSquad look bad... Very Happy


Re: The perfect Jagged Alliance[message #100809] Fri, 19 March 2004 01:58 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Dante

 
Messages:8
Registered:March 2004
Location: South European Union
Yeah I stand corrected, I tought all you had 2 do was to edit a buncha *.ini s and put height width 1024 768 and change a buncha stuff ehehehe.

what do you expect from me I'm latin Wink
Re: The perfect Jagged Alliance[message #100810] Fri, 19 March 2004 11:28 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Digicrab

 
Messages:254
Registered:December 2003

Quote:
Originally posted by Shanga:
Isn't that a DX9 lib?

So first we need to budge JA2 from its old DX5 libs. And I'm afraid that's quite a task, since dear MS changed a lot between DX5 and DX9.
Shanga, you win the yearly understatement award! Direct Draw was frigin axed between 5 and 9. If JA2 is ever converted to DX9, Mr. Satan :diabolical: better start investing in electric heating now! Regardless, I'm sure our resident Linux zealots will insist on OpenGL.
Re: The perfect Jagged Alliance[message #100811] Sat, 20 March 2004 22:45 Go to previous messageGo to next message
bold

 
Messages:30
Registered:March 2004

yep. opengl or sdl would be much better.
and for those animations *.PNG could be used instead of gif or what else you were talking about.
Re: The perfect Jagged Alliance[message #100812] Sun, 21 March 2004 01:36 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Kaerar

 
Messages:2050
Registered:January 2003
Location: Australia :D
Cool I can handle png no probs.
But what are you guys thinking on the subject?
Also how are we going to have the animations accessed. STI files can have huge amounts of anims and yet be tiny in size.

Could the way the game search's for animations be altered? Like it finds the anim for leather jacket body and apply's the correct colours for skin/pants/shirt/hair colour as per your IMP, NPC/RPC have been given by proedit?

This way allows each anim to be separate and therefore much more easily accessable for modding than before (no frame limit on anims etc...).

Also could heads, torso's, and legs be split for anim purposes? This way legs could be the base of the anim the torso the middle layer and the head the top layer. Just a thought but it might make jumping and death anims more difficult.


Re: The perfect Jagged Alliance[message #100813] Sun, 21 March 2004 06:23 Go to previous messageGo to next message
joker_pl

 
Messages:35
Registered:March 2004
Location: Poland - Cracow

we can use PCX for anims. how we can do it? my proposition is to make 1 file for 1 animated object (put for ex 10x10 images to 100x100 1 image and we will have 100 frames). thats how its done in many games. but thats mine proposition. it will be not hard to implemate. ow btw can any 1 make blitting functions in asm for 8, 16, 24 BPP image > 32 buffer?? just look to vobject_blitters and make some of them to work with 32 buffer i need them to run 32bit thx a lot
Re: The perfect Jagged Alliance[message #100814] Sun, 21 March 2004 17:26 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Ghrad

 
Messages:5
Registered:November 2003

Would it be much trouble to incorporate custom color choices? And maybe an option to let us buy gear before going in? I mean, afterall you are a merc...you've got cash...surely you can spend it on some gear, since the plot couldn't be the 1st mission ever.
Re: The perfect Jagged Alliance[message #100815] Mon, 22 March 2004 04:04 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Dante

 
Messages:8
Registered:March 2004
Location: South European Union
baby steps... baby steps...

Just picture it 1024*768 and your mercs lookin nafty with vests and helmets Very Happy not to mention specific models for each weapon Very Happy Very Happy Very Happy

damn that would bring ja2 to the year 2004
Re: The perfect Jagged Alliance[message #100816] Mon, 05 April 2004 05:43 Go to previous messageGo to next message
storytime

 
Messages:19
Registered:March 2004
Location: Ontario
Graphic hardware acceleration is virtually all that has changed in the last 5 years. Just use some OpenGL filters rather than drawing hi-res images. See what it's done for ZDoomGL. http://sourceforge.net/projects/zdoomgl

There are already many ideas. Now comes organisation. I suggest making a task ladder and assigning people to them so that everyone knows what is being done at any given time.
Re: The perfect Jagged Alliance[message #100817] Wed, 07 April 2004 08:54 Go to previous messageGo to next message
KIA

 
Messages:93
Registered:November 2002
Location: Virginia (USA)
Oooooooo!!! If the laptop display is larger, there's more room for STUFF!!! Stuff like a larger merc team... like larger overland maps... like... like... umm...

Have we already mentioned more item slots for the mercs like belt slots and vest slots (vest done in UC)? Have we mentioned resizing items into three categories (small, medium and large) for new slots? I mean, we should be able to carry six syringes, detonators, 5-round clips, camo kits or other "small items" in a medium slot and a dozen in a large slot...
Re: The perfect Jagged Alliance[message #100818] Wed, 07 April 2004 10:06 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Kaerar

 
Messages:2050
Registered:January 2003
Location: Australia :D
That was just a graphic limitation originally anyway. THe largest graphic the game had was 8 slots, so when you used it for 12 the game would crash searching for a 12 slot graphic, then using the 8 slot for 12 and the excess images "spilling over" causing lots of hassle!

But yes Laptop editing will be fun, plus modifying the mercs carry portraits (which there are three of).


Re: The perfect Jagged Alliance[message #100819] Wed, 07 April 2004 17:43 Go to previous message
Louis

 
Messages:7
Registered:April 2001
Location: Newcastle,NSW,Australia
You should at least consider moving up to DX7. This is the last version of DirectX that supports DirectDraw2D. The later version contain DirectDraw but no changes have been made. They are left there purely for backward compatibility. Much of the DirectDraw stuff has features that aren't fully implemented and as of now never will be. Still, DX7 is the most complete implementation. As I said, its also in DX9 - anything after 7 will do.
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