Home » SIRTECH CLASSICS » Jagged Alliance: Unfinished Business » Vanilla Modding » C Programmers Wanted!
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| Re: C Programmers Wanted![message #100354]
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Wed, 17 March 2004 18:45  
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 Hayden |
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Messages:1
Registered:March 2004 |
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What we need to do is add another variable.
Instead of having The PLAYER and COMPUTER. We add another PLAYER to the list of variables. Or completley kill the computer, and make the user add the inputs, instrad of the computer deciding.
Another Idea is once MIKE attacked with a group of 18 or so enemies on one of my towns. His picture came up in auto resolve. If anyone else had that proble then please tell me, because that alone could solve the Riddle for two player action. As a NPC actually traveled on the world map. All we would have to do is change the computer input, and prompt the user for commands.
The only major problem I see is that networking is a problem. There would have to be a program that will read inputs over networks and decifer them.
All those ideas and very general, but I think someone with a bit of talent can look for the MIKE random bug, and USE that, because in effect the program has been broken by the USER, to do things that it otherwise wouldn't.
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Civilian
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| Re: C Programmers Wanted![message #100356]
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Fri, 19 March 2004 02:16
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| deathadder |
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Messages:4
Registered:December 2003
Location: detroit, mi |
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Hey there can I get a white hat? I finally got around to reinstalling vc6 and I'm ready to go!
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Civilian
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| Re: C Programmers Wanted![message #100365]
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Tue, 23 March 2004 05:59
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| kovi |
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Messages:2
Registered:March 2004
Location: St. Paul, MN, USA |
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Quote:Linx:
EEEEK! A slashdot post about this! And here I was wondering where all these whitehats suddenly came from  I posted it on /. a while ago, and since I haven't seen it there, I thought it was rejected 
Anyway, if there is any help needed with Linux port, let me know - I'll gladly contribute some time in coding/testing. The best case scenario however would be if Matthew P. (ex-Tribesoft, guy who did the Linux port) could "contribute" Linux port source, so we'd only need to keep it in sync with the Windows source.
Don't know if he is allowed to do that, though...
Regards,
kovi
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Civilian
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| Re: C Programmers Wanted![message #100367]
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Tue, 23 March 2004 09:03
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| zborgerd |
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Messages:15
Registered:March 2004 |
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Quote:Originally posted by kovi:
Quote:Linx:
EEEEK! A slashdot post about this! And here I was wondering where all these whitehats suddenly came from I posted it on /. a while ago, and since I haven't seen it there, I thought it was rejected
Anyway, if there is any help needed with Linux port, let me know - I'll gladly contribute some time in coding/testing. The best case scenario however would be if Matthew P. (ex-Tribesoft, guy who did the Linux port) could "contribute" Linux port source, so we'd only need to keep it in sync with the Windows source.
Don't know if he is allowed to do that, though...
Regards,
kovi I wrote Mathieu about it. No response so far. I also wrote Titan-Computer. No response so far.
It's no big deal, I suppose. I was hoping we could get the Linux source to make it a bit easier to do the porting work, but I suppose it can be rewritten without too much trouble.
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Private
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| Re: C Programmers Wanted![message #100369]
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Tue, 23 March 2004 11:06
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| Jujigatame |
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Messages:38
Registered:March 2004
Location: Oxford, UK |
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3 years c (POS, anti-virus, automation controls - Watcom, etc.)
4 years c++ (anti-virus, MS Exchange, Visual C++ 6)
Wildfire hasn't released over here (UK)- wondering if I can be of any help with the project.
===
Comments:
[1] conversion to c++
Forget it. Ain't going to happen. Gordian knot. Complete re-write.
[2] CVS
You get what you pay for. I'm not a fan of CVS, as I've lost source to it repeatedly, there's no real checkout method (lock the file). Numerous problems with it.
[3] code review
I assume it's not going to be willy-nilly checking in, is it? Someone's going to be reviewing check-ins?
[4] priorities
Seeing as it's the modding community which this should serve, perhaps some thought should be given to moving as much as possible to ini files. Some people jizz themselves over XML, but ini files can be edited by anyone, and are MUCH simpler to add to.
[5] compiler
What's the compiler to use? VC++ 6? Or were they using something strange? I don't feel like messing with dozens of make files, so I'll just get my paws on whatever will work quickest.
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Private 1st Class
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| Re: C Programmers Wanted![message #100370]
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Tue, 23 March 2004 11:30
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| Headshot |
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Messages:176
Registered:May 2002
Location: Los Angeles ( Hollywood )... |
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@Zborgerd
I have to disagree with you on the nothing to gain part of your statement. First off it splits the people working on the project into different camps with different objectives and priorities. It also means people will spend more time trying to get things to work on GCC rather than making the game modable as it is, thus taking alot more time getting things done. With the amount of work to be done it really does not make sense to have to remake something at the begining of the project.
As I have stated before ( and it was called ranting )... We have a program that was written in MSVC 6.0 and spending weeks or months of time making it compatable with something else is at this point non-productive to making the existing game more modable in a timely manner. After things have been externalized, tools made, and a good working, simple to mod item is created, THEN go ahead and take the data and make it compatable for GCC and porting to other platforms.
To say there is nothing to gain is not so, TIME and a WORKING modable game with tools is what is to gain.
We have a saying in the industry I worked in for 15 years ( Computer Industry, Manufacturing and Retail Sales )... keep it simple, fast, and usable by stupid people. Don't fix things that aren't broken, and spend your time wisely.
I think that if everyone really wants a simple modable game code, to come out of this in the shortest amount of time, we need to keep focused on one language and one version until it is complete. Then if people still want it in another format or language it can then be ported, but you will know you have a working model to work with. Mods can be made instead of waiting for this or that to be recoded for another language or platform.
Just my opinion.
Headshot
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Staff Sergeant
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| Re: C Programmers Wanted![message #100371]
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Tue, 23 March 2004 11:43
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| Digicrab |
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Messages:253
Registered:December 2003 |
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That's allright Headshot, I've a feeling that no-one will have the tenacity to do a gcc build. If there is such a person, then JA2 deserves to work in gcc, linux, whatever. Many of the *nix people are just making smart noises right now about porting and whatnot. Now, if some of them actually sit down and port it, I'll be very impressed. However, I think that most of them will lose interest and give up after a while. I don't have anything against *nix or gcc, really, but JA2 was written in VC6 and that's the way it is now. I get the feeling that many of the "let's port it to gcc/*nix" posts translate to "Can someone port it to gcc/*nix for me?".
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Master Sergeant
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| Re: C Programmers Wanted![message #100372]
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Tue, 23 March 2004 14:22
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| zborgerd |
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Messages:15
Registered:March 2004 |
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Quote:Originally posted by Digicrab:
That's allright Headshot, I've a feeling that no-one will have the tenacity to do a gcc build. If there is such a person, then JA2 deserves to work in gcc, linux, whatever. Many of the *nix people are just making smart noises right now about porting and whatnot. Now, if some of them actually sit down and port it, I'll be very impressed. However, I think that most of them will lose interest and give up after a while. I don't have anything against *nix or gcc, really, but JA2 was written in VC6 and that's the way it is now. I get the feeling that many of the "let's port it to gcc/*nix" posts translate to "Can someone port it to gcc/*nix for me?". Kinda a disappointing response, but whatever...
Anyway. Not all of us are doing this simply for the sake of being able to mod it. Some of us just want to be able to play the game on our favorite OS with the expansions. Titan Computer/Tribsofts version is also very difficult to use on modern machines. It doesn't seem to be very future-proof.
By the way... When did Linux users need someone to do the port for them? The community built an enterprise-grade OS from scratch, after all.
Oh well. Maybe you need your fork after all.
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Private
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| Re: C Programmers Wanted![message #100374]
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Tue, 23 March 2004 19:47
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| Jujigatame |
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Messages:38
Registered:March 2004
Location: Oxford, UK |
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Quote:Originally posted by Headshot:
@Zborgerd
We have a saying in the industry I worked in for 15 years ( Computer Industry, Manufacturing and Retail Sales )... keep it simple, fast, and usable by stupid people. Don't fix things that aren't broken, and spend your time wisely.
Right - you're caerainly not a manager...
Quote:
I think that if everyone really wants a simple modable game code, to come out of this in the shortest amount of time, we need to keep focused on one language and one version until it is complete. Then if people still want it in another format or language it can then be ported, but you will know you have a working model to work with. Mods can be made instead of waiting for this or that to be recoded for another language or platform.
One language? I don't see why the resources can't be altered to make it more moddable. Just use reg/ini settings to define resource locations, and allow the modders to replace them as they see fit. Separating this from the build shouldn't be that hard.
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Private 1st Class
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| Re: C Programmers Wanted![message #100376]
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Tue, 23 March 2004 21:33
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| Jujigatame |
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Messages:38
Registered:March 2004
Location: Oxford, UK |
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Quote:Originally posted by Headshot:
And if you dont know someone personally you should not try and decide for yourself what they do and what they know. You should ask and maybe you would learn a thing or two ( maybe not ) instead of jumping to conclusions.
Relax. It was a bit of light-hearted sarcasm. I have a deep resentment of upper management, who are almost exclusively incompetent technically, and make demands to product requirements that cannot be met (impossible) or cannot be met within a realistic time frame. Maybe it's different where you worked, but my experience has shown me that incompetence and arse-kissing is the key to promotion. As you might guess. I'm a grunt. "Mr. Senior Software Engineer" grunt, if you prefer.
As for languages - you seem to be talking about code language. I thought you were referring to localization/internationalization. My mistake as to the terminology usage.
I agree with you, though - changing from C and VC6 would be... non-trivial. I suspect that anyone supporting such an idea has never dealt with anything more complex than "hello world". In addition to getting the poxy thing to build, I'd guess that performance differences would require reworking the architecture and code in several areas. In short, lots of pain, little/no gain.
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Private 1st Class
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| Re: C Programmers Wanted![message #100378]
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Tue, 23 March 2004 23:27
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| zborgerd |
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Messages:15
Registered:March 2004 |
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Quote:Originally posted by Shanga:
I think you people got a bit overheated and lost track of the objective.
From porting the game entirely to Linux to making it compile on gcc for Windows is a loooong way. And it's not in the scope of this project. Why not?
Because we already have a working Linux version. Re-doing our own is both an insult to Tribsoft and a waste of time. They will probably release the source code sometime in the future, too...
So, everyone...cool off.
If it's simple enough to make JA2 compile on BOTH gcc and VC6, ok. I agree we should look into it. If not, we stay with VC6. No offense, Shanga, but you've probably never played the Linux version.
http://www.happypenguin.org/show?Jagged%20Alliance%202
So, really, it depends on what you consider to be a "working Linux version". Many people don't exactly consider JA2 for Linux to be working. And besides... It doesn't even support the expansions when/if it is actually working.
Wheather or not (the company formerly known as) Tribsoft is insulted is not an issue to me, if I want to port the game again. Anyway, Mathieu seems to be all for a rewrite of the game, as he mentioned on Linuxgames.com. Since cross-platform compatibility is not the scope of the project here, as you say, to port to other platforms, then maybe we're (non-Windows users) in the wrong place.
And if some of you are simply thinking that we want GCC builds simply because we don't want to do the dirty work, you're wrong. I'm simply trying to get people to come to some sort of agreement so that we don't need seperate forks of this game.
Well. Good luck with your modding project.
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| Re: C Programmers Wanted![message #100382]
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Wed, 24 March 2004 03:22
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| kovi |
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Messages:2
Registered:March 2004
Location: St. Paul, MN, USA |
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Quote:Digicrab:
I've a feeling that no-one will have the tenacity to do a gcc build Digicarb, there is no reason to go so ballistic on that one (quiting and so on). No right-minded person would even try to go for it with the code currently available, because it is exactly as you said: Quote: JA2 was written in VC6 But, there is/was a Linux port of it, considerable amount of money/time was spent on it, and there is no point to re-invent the wheel. All I am talking about is this: if we could get that source (unlikely), it would be good to keep up with the changes you guys make on win32 part (hard to do, but possible).
And, trust me on that one, it is not "making a noise". I am willing to spend as much time as it'll be needed on doing just that. No alternative versions crap goes into the picture at any time. Just one version, maybe two platforms.
Regards,
kovi
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Civilian
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| Re: C Programmers Wanted![message #100387]
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Tue, 06 April 2004 09:56
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| Kurgis |
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Messages:4
Registered:April 2004
Location: England |
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Computer science and geology graduate with some knowledge of C/c++/Java - but my main strengths are databases and scripting (VB) and they are limited to be brutally honest to myself.
My best use is (IMHO!) design of games/scenarios - troubleshooting etc as i've been around for a bit - i'm just saying with my knowledge of code I know when and why to make the right noises to programmers - but not the direct code solutions.
Oh, masters degree in GIS if thats a help - I still have access to NASA's ASTER program for satellite data - only useful I suppose if you want some high level imagery.
Just throwing my oar in as I've really enjoyed the JA series and will do what I can to carry it on. Can't see myself helping out to much at this stage - but i'll be available if you need me.
(Really wish I could remember my old logon on this forum!)
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Civilian
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