Home » SIRTECH CLASSICS » Jagged Alliance 2 » JA2 Technical Department » Silencers
| Silencers[message #11926]
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Mon, 03 October 2005 12:38 
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 Snap |
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Messages:286
Registered:September 2000
Location: USA (by way of the Old Wo... |
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Right now a silencer in decent condition will reduce a gun's noise volume to 1. I say that's too boring :diabolical:
Firstly, I suggest that an item with the silencer attribute be given a noise reduction rating, e.g. 90%. This way we can have more than one silencer in the game. The silencer rating will act upon the guns's noise volume (ubAttackVolume). So a gun with ubAttackVolume = 50 will have it reduced to 5 by a 90% silencer.
Speaking of which, noise volumes need to be stratified more. Most pistol-caliber weapons should be much quieter than rifle-caliber weapons. This way we can have an appreciable difference in silencer effectiveness.
Perhaps even better would be to implement a two-step silencing mechanism. Pick a threashold volume - let's say, 50 - which sort of models the threshold between subsonic and supersonic ammo. Most pistol-caliber weapons will have a noise volume below or just a above this threashold. The silencer will reduce any volume below the threashold in proportion to its noise reduction rating, but anything above that will only be halved. So, for example:
Glock 9mm, ubAttackVolume = 40
Silenced (90%) = 40 * 0.10 = 4
M4 5.56mm, ubAttackVolume = 70
Silenced (90%) = 50 * 0.10 + (70 - 50) / 2 = 15
Dragunov 7.62R, ubAttackVolume = 85
Silenced (90%) = 50 * 0.10 + (85 - 50) / 2 = 22
Barrett .50, ubAttackVolume = 100
Silenced (90%) = 50 * 0.10 + (100 - 50) / 2 = 30
It would probably be more logical to attach the volume attribute to ammo, rather than to the gun, but waepons such as LAW, which don't have ammo, make this problematic. Perhaps we could introduce a "subsonic" attribute to ammo, which would serve to lower the noise volume on guns in which it exceeds the "subsonic" threashold.
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Master Sergeant
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| Re: Silencers[message #11936]
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Tue, 04 October 2005 11:06 
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| Snap |
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Messages:286
Registered:September 2000
Location: USA (by way of the Old Wo... |
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Bear (and everyone): You can make any weapon silencable even now. In fact, you could do that with W4st's editor. The problem as I see it is that the way silencers work now, you can either silence a weapon completely, or not at all. (Well, that's not quite true: you could also decrease a weapon's noise radius, which is how VAL is currently implemented.) What I propose doesn't change what you can or can't silence - it changes how you can do it, and gives you more leverage at that. Insead of all or nothing, you can have a compromise, where a suppressed assault carbine is quieter than an unsuppressed one, but still quite a bit louder than a suppressed 9mm pistol. But whether you want to have suppressed carbines at all is still up to you.
Wil: I think you are right: special "subsonic" ammo can simply have a silencer attribute set, which will act in conjunction with the attached silencer, so no need for a special tag. And yes, ammo magazines can have any positive or negative modifiers associated with them: range, to-hit, draw cost, you name it.
Madd: The reason I was thinking of a non-linear silencer response is that the difference in volume between pistol-caliber and rifle-caliber weapons didn't seem enough, even with increased stratification. But this can be addressed in another way: have one silencer that can only be used with pistol-caliber weapons, and another with a lower rating (say, 75%) that can be attached to certain rifle-caliber weapons.
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Master Sergeant
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| Re: Silencers[message #11937]
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Tue, 04 October 2005 14:17
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| KIA |
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Messages:92
Registered:November 2002
Location: Virginia (USA) |
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Silencers require regular cleaning and maintenance to remain effective. How do you propose to reflect this fact? Certainly they should wear out (foul) fairly quickly, particularly with bursts. In fact, they're usually relatively ineffective with respect to bursts since there's too much gas expanding too quicky. Perhaps multiple categoties of silencers could include the following: one-shot "improvised" silencers (2-liter plastic pop bottle, duct tape, decreases accuracy 50%, sound 75%, no silence effect for burst), basic silencers (machine shop, aluminum or steel bar, decreases accuracy 25% (can't see over it very well, obscures sights), decreases sound 85%, wears quickly), advanced silencers (store-bought only, requires special repair kit with steel wool, replacement washers, cleaning brush, etc. - would simply merge cleaning kit with silencer to effect repair) and advanced integral silencers which are incorporated into the firearm and are designed for field support and maintenance. The exact effectiveness numbers can be adjusted as appropriate. Also note, however, many nations are alleged to use silenced .22 caliber sniper weapons. The silencers for these weapons are almost totally effective and it is said that you can only hear the action of the gun as it cycles. Perhaps the silencer should reduce the base weapon noise and larger caliber ammo should increase the base weapon noise?
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Corporal 1st Class
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| Re: Silencers[message #11940]
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Tue, 04 October 2005 23:13
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| Wil473 |
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Messages:2815
Registered:September 2004
Location: Canada |
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This is something I thought of before 1.13, and now is possible. Sorry if it's a bit off topic:
With 1.13 now, a non-repairable LMG barrel attachment (barrel extender that gives the LMG all of its range) is now possible with the externalizations, ever growing list of stats and 5000 items to fill up. With some of the AP reduction bonuses, it should even be possible to "disable" the LMG when there is no barrel attached (set base firing AP's to some excessively high number for the LMG, the barrel when attached will in addition to providing 30-40 tiles of range, will also lower AP's to something useable by the Merc's). Set it as a default attachment (but easily removable) and the AI's LMG's won't be paperweights.
Back to suppressors, Snap, it was your idea really, just want to confirm if the percentages of sound dampening could be added (seemed like a natural extension). Good to hear the other stats work on magazines too, but to avoid strange magazine loading/unloading errors it would be safer to have a designated "subsonic" type or types in the ammotype list. Not sure which would be easier: making a different subsonic round for each cal, or putting the different characteristics in the subsonic magazines. Incidentally there are already subsonic cals in game that may impact any final sound suppression system (or they will be impacted by the system), the Heavy 9mm and the .45APC perhaps (need to find additional references for this one).
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