Home » CHIT-CHAT » Off Topic Discussions » Firearms & the Art/Science of Shooting
| Firearms & the Art/Science of Shooting[message #331330]
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Mon, 17 March 2014 02:56 
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 Anthropoid |
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Messages:145
Registered:February 2014 |
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I have the impression that quite a few of you guys have a background in military, law enforcement or other basis for knowledge and experience with firearms and shooting. I will soon be moving back to Georgia and intend to get into target shooting and keeping a handgun at home for protection.
I have a number of questions about stuff that I'd imagine some of you guys might have insights on, and maybe just a general thread for discussing firearms and shooting would be interesting?
My first queston:
1. What is "accuracy" really? I see lots of talk about the different accuracy of firearms, but I'm not entirely sure what people mean by that, nor what the accuracy numbers in the game really represent. Is "accuracy:"
(a) if you vice a firearm into a table and use a laser or other means to point it directly at a target, then fire it repeatedly (bolted so that it is impossible for it to move), the amount of variance in where bullets actually hit at any given distance?
or,
(b) roughly the same measurement except done with a human shooter?
If b is the answer, then how do you account for things like human skill level, fatigue, what they ate for breakfast, etc.?
If b is the answer, then I would imagine that the accuracy of any given firearm would actually vary quite a bit between different shooters. For example, even with marksmanship held constant, a huge man with gigantic paws would (I would think) find it more difficult to be accurate with a compact pistol than say a petite woman. Conversely, a really strong person, particularl arm and hand strength as well as shoulder strength, would presumably find a heavy gun with a lot of recoil to be less difficult to be accurate with than a small person.
Some other questions:
(2) The HK USP: is this gun actually overpriced relative to its merits?
(3) PS90, Tavor, or Mini-14, if I just want something fun to plink with, which is cost-effective and also could be useful in the event of home defense, which one?
(4) Is a .38 S&W really all you need for home-defense / conceal carry? Or rather, is it an archaic abomination, and one would have to be crazy to pick it over say a Glock?
Bit more background on me and why I'm starting the thread, my posting of similar questions in a thread at another regular bbs haunt of mine, where there are quite a few vets. There is a good 8 or 10 pages where half-dozen guys chime in on various topics stemming from this initial post and it gives an idea of the sort of discussion that I'd imagine would be quite interesting to have with this community.
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"Anthropoid"So, looks like I should be back to Atlanta in a few months, and hopefully will find me a new job. When I do I want to get into shooting: join a gun club, and procure a few weapons, maybe eventually even take some of those tactical classes. I'd be very curious to hear you guys think about that in general. My motivation is that, I have done a little bit of shooting years ago and really enjoyed it. I used to own a Norinco 9mm tokarev knockoff (given my my father in law to 'protect his daughter') and have fired a glock 9mm, shotguns, and a couple rifles (many, many years ago).
I found the art of shooting, and caring for the firearm to be strangely meditative and pleasurable.
So I'm thinking I'd like to at least have: 1. pistol; 2. rifle; 3. shotgun, all of which ideally are a model that is useful for home defense.
For the pistol, I'm leaning toward HK USP or Glock.
For the rifle, I'm leaning towards either Tavor or PS90. Long-term maybe also get a bolt action type.
For shotgun, I have no idea, and actually the shotgun is the thing I'm least interested in target shooting with, though it might actually be the cheapest gun to start with, and also potentially quite useful for home defense. I understand that skeet shooting guns are very different than hunting guns?
Obviously, what I'll want to do is to try out different guns before I buy one (via whatever groups I join down in Atlanta) but I'm just thinking slowly and far in advance about what to think about as possibilities.
So three specific questions:
1. The HK USP vs say a Glock 17? Any thoughts or experiences of comparison?
2. The myriad Glock options: what do you guys think about this "high pressure rounds 'suck'" claim? I hear some people claim that rounds like the .40 S&W are simply too much power for the size of the casing and the pistol, leading to the weapon being (a) less easy to use in rapid fashion and (b) also leading to faster wear.
Would this apply also to the .40, .357 and .45 versions of the Glock? Or is that whole line of argument just BS in your opinion(s)?
3. Tavor vs. PS90? Any thoughts or points of comparison?
Also in this post a couple of pages later, I clarify what my interests are and some of these guys start to provide some greater detail. It is funny, the one Austrian army dude (Reinald) of course advises Glock, bless his heart 
The 50 to 60 year old ex-American soldiers (Doggie and Old Eagle) advise:
"doggie"pistol: M-1911 .45 Used by the U.S. armed forces for more than a hundred years for a reason.
Rifle: M-1903 Springfield. classic rifle that will appreciate in value.
Shotgun: Remington 870 all the shotgun you will ever need at a reasonable price.
I prefer classic weapons to the new fangled yuppie shit
Immediately after that post, the discussion gets a bit more active and the various options for handgun (Sig, Glock, Ruger, etc.) start to get their religious advocates 
Some fun guys who hang at that forum and that thread is a pretty interesting exchange of view points.
So that is probably way more than enough for a first post to get a thread like this going . . . if it ever gets going that is.
[Updated on: Mon, 17 March 2014 06:36] by Moderator Report message to a moderator
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Sergeant
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