Home » SIRTECH CLASSICS » Jagged Alliance 2 » JA2 Solutions. Tips. Spoilers! » 76 Elites counter attack Dressan, what the hell???
| Some questions regarding Drassen counter-attack and whatsnot...[message #199080]
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Tue, 14 October 2008 03:53 
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 Shamrok |
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Messages:3
Registered:October 2008 |
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Ok, so I'm playing with the 1.13 mod (and I'm a first time player...I must be crazy! :silly: ). And I'm currently trying to deal with Drassen counter-attack :rifle: . Drassen mine has already been cleared and is now full of rotting corpses. My ammo is running kinda low though. I should scavenge some stuff of slain enemies, but most of them have crappy pistols. I'm currently training militia in Drassen Mine to help with liberation of other sectors. I should probably hire some mercs to help out too.
But anyways, lets get to the point. Before I moved in on Drassen Mine. Is saw several [color:#FF0000]?[/color] in squares nearby Drassen, meaning that there were enemies there. After I liberated the living f*** out of Drassen mine, I moved into the map screen and they were gone. Where did they go? Is it possible they moved into Drassen while I was fighting, or maybe they ran away? Can they even do that? 'Cause time is paused while the battle is going, right? So things on the world map shouldn't be able to move. Maybe it works differently for enemies...
Also, which sector should I capture first? Northern Drassen doesn't seem to have any significance, nor does it provide any tactical advantage. Airport, on the other hand, is important, as I need it to order stuff from Bobby (and, right now, I REALLY need those supplies). So, my plan was to capture the airport, find Skyrider, take out the SAM site, order some supplies, liberate the rest of Drassen and move on. Anyone have any suggestions? Or, perhaps, a better plan?
Thanks in advance.
[Updated on: Tue, 14 October 2008 03:54] by Moderator Report message to a moderator
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Civilian
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| Re: Some questions regarding Drassen counter-attack and whatsnot...[message #199258]
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Thu, 16 October 2008 06:24 
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| Matryoshka |
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Messages:90
Registered:September 2004
Location: New Zealand |
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PhazorOk, so I'm playing with the 1.13 mod (and I'm a first time player...I must be crazy! :silly: ). And I'm currently trying to deal with Drassen counter-attack :rifle: . Drassen mine has already been cleared and is now full of rotting corpses. My ammo is running kinda low though. I should scavenge some stuff of slain enemies, but most of them have crappy pistols. I'm currently training militia in Drassen Mine to help with liberation of other sectors. I should probably hire some mercs to help out too.
But anyways, lets get to the point. Before I moved in on Drassen Mine. Is saw several [color:#FF0000]?[/color] in squares nearby Drassen, meaning that there were enemies there. After I liberated the living f*** out of Drassen mine, I moved into the map screen and they were gone. Where did they go? Is it possible they moved into Drassen while I was fighting, or maybe they ran away? Can they even do that? 'Cause time is paused while the battle is going, right? So things on the world map shouldn't be able to move. Maybe it works differently for enemies...
The sector can only hold so many enemies at once, so the 'spares' loiter in their original sectors until there's room for them - which you make by killing government troops during the fighting, and their replacements appear on the edge(s) of the D13 map as a stream of reinforcements until all of those attack-parties are depleted. Hence the piles of bodies. :rifle:
(Depending on your game-settings, you might also have drawn the patrols around Drassen's perimeter into the fight at the mine.)
Quote: Also, which sector should I capture first? Northern Drassen doesn't seem to have any significance, nor does it provide any tactical advantage. Airport, on the other hand, is important, as I need it to order stuff from Bobby (and, right now, I REALLY need those supplies). So, my plan was to capture the airport, find Skyrider, take out the SAM site, order some supplies, liberate the rest of Drassen and move on. Anyone have any suggestions? Or, perhaps, a better plan? Thanks in advance.
That's the way I've usually done it in v1.13, though I usually take C13 as well, both to loot more gear from the corpses of the garri-troopers and to complete the Doreen quest for additional loyalty/mine-income when I eventually clean out D13. Then again, I usually start with three well-edited IMPs and a decent amount of cash. Players working on thinner initial budgets often accept the counter-attack as the price of having the early income from the Drassen mine - though if you use 'drop all' from the options-menu, the piles of equipment you get from all those dead government grunts can help 'pay' for the defence in their own right, especially at higher difficulty settings where you get better gear-drops. :luckystrike:
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Corporal 1st Class
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| Troop Availability for Drassen Counter-attack...[message #205438]
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Sat, 03 January 2009 13:15
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| joezer_m |
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Messages:11
Registered:July 2004
Location: Indonesia |
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First of all, I'm not a serious player (i.e. a lousy strategist who manages to fumble along with headrush tactics...  )
Anyway, in my latest playthrough, I decided to take the middle and mine area of drassen first, take over Chitzena, and then Cambria. And for Cambria, I also left one sector untouched. I assumed (wrongly I guess?) that since I haven't actually liberated any cities (except for Chitzena, which is pretty much out of the way), I could delay any large scale counter-attack, while accumulating cash for some heavy weaponry. So, after my little trip here and there, I went back to Drassen, liberated the airport, ordered sniper rifles, mortars and LMGs from BR, and dug-in for what I was sure to be a long, drawn-out defense... But as I was getting ready at Drassen, scores of enemy troops began to attack Cambria, eventually retaking the whole city.
So, I was wondering, can th troops sent to counter-attack Drassen be distracted by othe occupied sectors along the way? Or is what I experienced simply a fluke?
Many thanks before, and terribly sorry if this has been discussed somewhere else before... 
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Private
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| 76 Elites counter attack Dressan, what the hell???[message #207193]
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Mon, 26 January 2009 02:51
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| furousha |
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Messages:4
Registered:January 2009 |
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so i started a new game on regular dificulty when i figured out you can get more than 1 IMP, i figured if i'm getting 5 free mercs i could due to crank the difficulty up a bit, i've only played 1.13 on easy mode. so i have my 6 IMP's, i hire Shadow and recruit Ira, split the team into two 4 man squads, sending 4 Imps to Chitzena and Shadow, Ira, and two Imps to drassen (looking back, i should have split the team 2/6, my night ops/stealthy imp with a silenced Mp5 mooped up every single enemy in both sectors by herself, while in Drassen, especially in the mine sector, i ran into a LOT more resistance, and it was a lot harder to take)
saved my game after i took drassen, the counter attack comes in about 12 hours, i've never been able to train a squad of militia in time, (i have 2 veterans, 6 regulars, and 2 greens left over from the group of 14 greens i had attack the sector with me. [trained 1 squad in the first sector, lost six in the attack on the second sector], trained another squad in the second sector before attacking the third])
anyway, with no time to train i just switch to healing everyone. shadow leaves about an hour before the attack comes because i dont have enough money to renew him, by the way, did something change with the money distribution system? it used to be you'd get a fraction of your daily income every 4 or 6 hours (i forget) but even though i have a daily income of 6k at this point i dont see 1 cent in over 12 hours after taking the drassen mine.
aaaaany way. so yeah, shadow leaves then i get attacked, the red box that pops up says 15 enemies, but when i click auto resolve it says anywhere from 45-76 attackers and half of them are elites! (the other half are veterans) i mean, how the hell am i suposed to fight that off this early in the game, or at any point? i'm not sure i could fight off 76 elites/veterans even with 18 mercs fully armed and armored (i mean, im pretty sure i could win in the end, but not without losing several mercs)
i mean, 76 elites? what the hell? has this ever happened to anyone else? is it just a glitch in the auto resolve? is there something i can do? retreat, let them take the sector, and then retake it after training up militia and reinforcing the second squad of mercs with the first squad from Chitzena? anyone have any ideas?
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| Re: 76 Elites counter attack Dressan, what the hell???[message #207299]
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Tue, 27 January 2009 07:59
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| furousha |
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Messages:4
Registered:January 2009 |
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no, i've talked to the forman, i'm not that much of a noob ;p how the hell can you take down 100+ with nothing but MP5's and maybe 1 rifle or shotgun without taking heavy casualties that early? i mean, maybe its because i usually control Drassen and Chitzena by day 2 or 3, and i get counter attacked on day 3 or 4... it just doesnt seem possible. i can beat the counter attack on novice difficulty with 4-5 mercs while not taking significant damage... but thats only like 20 or 30 or so...
incedentily, i've been playing around with the auto resolve and manually resolving random encounters... what ive noticed is that when you resolve it yourself there is usually (but not always) the same number of enemies are actually in the sector, but roughly 20-25% of the time there's 50-100% more. However, every single time i auto resolve there are 100-200% more, and they're elites. there is a correct number of redshirts, but a ton of extra elites. (for example, the red box will say 5, then when you hit auto there are 5-10 elites and 5 red shirts.
also, another random gripe, what happened to the 20 Militia/Red Shirt limit per sector? and why can the AI break that rule, but i cant? i mean, i dont care that the AI can attack drassen from 3 sides with 76 soldiers, but when i have militia on three sides of them how come i cant pwn them with all 60 militia?
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| Re: 76 Elites counter attack Dressan, what the hell???[message #207306]
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Tue, 27 January 2009 12:43
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| muglebust |
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Messages:3
Registered:December 2008
Location: Denmark |
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furoushaalso, another random gripe, what happened to the 20 Militia/Red Shirt limit per sector? and why can the AI break that rule, but i cant? i mean, i dont care that the AI can attack drassen from 3 sides with 76 soldiers, but when i have militia on three sides of them how come i cant pwn them with all 60 militia?
It went away in 1.13, check the ini settings, both you and the enemy can call in reinforcements, you just cant train fast enough for the counter attack.
Check some of the threads on the subject, its supposed to be hard, and you can win the war even if you loose that battle. I find it helpfull to go after the groups before they reach the city, kill a few and retreat when the going gets too tough.
Flat out beating the attack is next to impossible on the harder difficulties, unless you cheat or resort to cheasy tactics. And there is an option for completly removeing the attack in the ini too, if you dont like it.
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| Re: 76 Elites counter attack Dressan, what the hell???[message #207339]
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Tue, 27 January 2009 17:57
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| SpaceViking |
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Messages:751
Registered:January 2004
Location: Rochester, Minnesota, USA |
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furoushano, i've talked to the forman, i'm not that much of a noob ;p
What's the loyalty in town? Did you kill any civilians, even indirectly?
Quote:how the hell can you take down 100+ with nothing but MP5's and maybe 1 rifle or shotgun without taking heavy casualties that early? i mean, maybe its because i usually control Drassen and Chitzena by day 2 or 3, and i get counter attacked on day 3 or 4... it just doesnt seem possible. i can beat the counter attack on novice difficulty with 4-5 mercs while not taking significant damage... but thats only like 20 or 30 or so...
Train militia in the other two sectors before you take the final sector then shift the militia immediately into the mine sector and the sector above it. BTW, take the mine sector first. That's the error most people make.
Stay on large rooftops in the middle of the map, use smoke and other grenades, concentrate on one side first and let the militia hold off the other ones, do a fighting retreat and then raid the sector every evening to whittle down their numbers... there are lots of things to do.
Quote:incedentily, i've been playing around with the auto resolve and manually resolving random encounters... what ive noticed is that when you resolve it yourself there is usually (but not always) the same number of enemies are actually in the sector, but roughly 20-25% of the time there's 50-100% more. However, every single time i auto resolve there are 100-200% more, and they're elites. there is a correct number of redshirts, but a ton of extra elites. (for example, the red box will say 5, then when you hit auto there are 5-10 elites and 5 red shirts.
Those are due to reinforcements. You will get them too if you have militia nearby.
Quote:also, another random gripe, what happened to the 20 Militia/Red Shirt limit per sector? and why can the AI break that rule, but i cant? i mean, i dont care that the AI can attack drassen from 3 sides with 76 soldiers, but when i have militia on three sides of them how come i cant pwn them with all 60 militia?
You can call in reinforcements too. Or set the militia to be up to 32 per sector (don't go above that unless you are using code you compiled from the latest source!). Or set the AI to have only 3 guys per squad. Or whatever you like. It is all controllable in the .ini file.
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| Re: 76 Elites counter attack Dressan, what the hell???[message #207345]
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Tue, 27 January 2009 18:54
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| Headshot |
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Messages:176
Registered:May 2002
Location: Los Angeles ( Hollywood )... |
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Here are a couple little tips if you want to try them in the future.
You can take all 3 Drassen sectors in the first night and have Ira talk with the priest to get the food for the rebels started, BUT DO NOT TALK TO THE MINE MANAGER. With 6 imps you do not need the money right away. Sell Off the dropped equipment and as soon as you take the Airport ( hopefully before midnight day 1 ) and make sure to contact Bobby Rays. That way you can rush overnight a few good weapons and some ammo. The counter attack will not be generated until you talk with the head miner and he starts working for you. You can spend a few days training up your militia and hitting the small patrols in and about the area selling off thier equipment, finding Skyrider, and taking the SAM site until you feel you have a well equipped militia and IMP force. Then Talk with the head Miner and start your big battle. Then it is up to you how to fight this battle as there are hundreds of tactics to win even if you do it on day 2.
Ok here is another method... take the Airport and the Factory sector but not the mine sector and train up your militia. Then go in and take the mine on say day 3 not to hard to do, but do not send any of your militia into the mine sector nor train any in that area. Let the bad guys come to you and you will notice that they will always surround the mine sector before they attack. Hit one of the groups outside the mine area ( east or west ) before they assault the Mine, in this way they can not reinforce themselves and should be easy pickings for a properly outfitted and tacticed squad. Oh but they will retake the mine ... Yep the others will so what, let them it wont cast you much cash and do not let any of your militia reinforce when they attack ( why waste good militia and money ) as you will retake it real fast. Now after you have killed off one of the flanking groups backtrack to the factory sector and then skirt the mine sector and hit the other Group still outside opposite the first one you hit. You will notice that they will not all go into the mine area if they have no one to fight so keep them split up. Ok now backtrack again to the factory and heal, and or rest up until you are ready to retake the mine. Then just walk in and kick ass, they wont have any reinforcements and since you did not let any of your militia go into the mine sector in the first attack you can either fight on your own, or if you think you need them, let them help with the retaking of the mine.
The Key things to remember are DONT TALK TO THE HEAD MINER UNTIL YOU WANT THE FIGHT and always fight on your terms not thiers. Learn some tactics and put them to good use. Sell off everything you dont actually need after every battle and put that money to good use equipping your MERCS first then worry about militia. Buy from Bobby Ray before Midnight so he will ship overnight and you get your gear in the next morning. After a few good battles of this scale you wont have any problem kicking the crap out of anyone you come across.
Headshot
[Updated on: Tue, 27 January 2009 18:59] by Moderator Report message to a moderator
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Staff Sergeant
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| Re: 76 Elites counter attack Dressan, what the hell???[message #207599]
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Fri, 30 January 2009 22:51
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| furousha |
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Messages:4
Registered:January 2009 |
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well i finally got it.
took the mine and then the airport, left the middle sector open. i aslo took the Sam and used the 4 mines there after starting the counter attack a few times to see where they came in the sector at.
i took the center sector and then sent a team of Raven and 3 Imps to the south sector. (Night Ops/Stealthy mk 90/night ops auto weapons mk 88/ night ops/stealth mk 86 - this one is my main medic, so agility and dex isnt on par with the others, but she's just mostly there to look in the opposite direction of the other three, to make sure i dint get flanked)
theres 18 in the sector, and after about an hour i've taken them all down with minimal damage, i send them back to the mine, but they dont get there before the counter attack does. so with only 3 IMPs Ira and Dimitri my only real option is to hole up in the bar. everyone picked up at least 1 point in marksmanship and only Dimitri took significant damage.
i've got another question related to 1.13... is it possible to practice skills above 85 and get increases? it used to be that skills at 85 were greyed out and you couldnt practice them, but now everything is green. so my question is: can you actually get incresesin stats at 85 if you set a merc to practice them?
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| Re: 76 Elites counter attack Dressan, what the hell???[message #207801]
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Mon, 02 February 2009 18:58
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| pants |
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Messages:6
Registered:January 2009 |
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Oops. Nothing to see here folks
[Updated on: Mon, 02 February 2009 19:00] by Moderator Report message to a moderator
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Private
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| Re: 76 Elites counter attack Dressan, what the hell???[message #212525]
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Wed, 08 April 2009 17:25
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| Dagon |
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Messages:11
Registered:January 2005 |
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Personally, I just make sure everyone has glaser ammunition and place them inside the mining corps building and occasionally fire a bullet so that all 200-odd elites walk in single-file into explosive headshots from Ira's starting equipment .38 of doom; obviously they fear her elite SAS training.
Unfortunately my luck of getting 200+ enemies almost every time causes the rest of the game to be stupidly easy unless I'm playing on INSANE difficulty since there's roughly two enemies left in the the army after this.
[Updated on: Wed, 08 April 2009 17:26] by Moderator Report message to a moderator
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Private
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| Re: 76 Elites counter attack Dressan, what the hell???[message #228576]
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Wed, 22 July 2009 13:55
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| Laclongquan |
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Messages:75
Registered:April 2007 |
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Heh, I wish! There's only Glock18 (4 pieces for ambidexterous IMP), AkSU for Auto/heavy, and all the rest use the starting weapons. At the first lull one run out to get a M24, but it's unfit for the hidey hole. M10s is half ruined. Igor still use his Grach pistol, plus one .38 as backup, is a pretty good demonstration of how bad the equipments are. Looking back, I should have defended Omerta one or two more battles to gain equipment, and one attack on the patrol around Drassen. Oh well, we survive, that is the important thing.
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Corporal
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| Re: 76 Elites counter attack Dressan, what the hell???[message #228614]
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Wed, 22 July 2009 20:12
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| Laclongquan |
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Messages:75
Registered:April 2007 |
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The first game of 113 those elites attack Drassen, they attack us at the middle town, while my team were holding up in some building minding my own business, and at night to boot. Finish the attack, puzzled a little at the amount of loots but dismissed out of hand, thinking just new mod and all. When people bitched about it in the forum I still didnt think of that attack, that's how the night plus defensive position worked.
The second game, it's at Airport. The northwest cut fence work wonder and I also finish them off with only a little trouble. Discover the marvelous attribute of opened door as a shield (enemies stand at your 3 o'clock, open the door and you got your self a shield). Still didnt think much of it. Plus I got 2 M24 to work with.
The third time, bang in the middle of the day with damn all equipment, Igor didnt even got his pants. Well, I fear the 80+ elite counter attack all right.
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Corporal
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| Re: 76 Elites counter attack Dressan, what the hell???[message #228711]
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Thu, 23 July 2009 03:35
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| Logisteric |
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Messages:3190
Registered:December 2008
Location: B |
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guess i had about 100 dcas - all in the mine-sector - when they were new to me i sent in the militia and retook the mine at night - THEY NEVER EVER ATTACKED ANYWHERE ELSE
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Captain
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