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Home » MODDING HQ 1.13 » Flugente's Magika Workshop » Absurdly small code changes  () 1 Vote
Re: Absurdly small code changes[message #360494 is a reply to message #360475] Fri, 03 July 2020 01:09 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Flugente

 
Messages:3539
Registered:April 2009
Location: Germany
If you have a slow PC, or are you using a debug exe, you might have come across an annoying issue:
While plotting a path for a squad in the strategic view, there is a noticeable lag. This can range from 'barely noticable' to 'it lags so hard it does barely register me aborting the plot, so it might be necessary to Alt+F4 the process'.
The reason for this behaviour is that the game constantly redraws the plotted path, and constantly recalculates the ETA.
ETA depends on travel speed.
Travel speed depends on encumbrance and stats, thus we constantly recalculate the selected squad's inventory weight. For this we loop over each item and all of it's attachments...

Well, no more of that. As our squad and their inventory cannot be changed while we plot the path, and we cannot advance the time either, we do the above evaluation only once from now (r8832) on. This stops the lag, even on a debug exe the plot is now lag-free.



I know now that it could never work between us, as much as we wanted to, it could never be! Not because you're a rabbit, but because you're black.

If you want, you can donate to me. This will not affect how and what I code, and I will not code specific features in return. I will be thankful though.


Re: Absurdly small code changes[message #360496 is a reply to message #360494] Sat, 04 July 2020 02:23 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Flugente

 
Messages:3539
Registered:April 2009
Location: Germany
One has two possible solutions to solving the Doreen quest: convincing her to leave peacefully, or killing her. The first solution yields double the loyalty bonus in Drassen.
Sirtech's intention was that if you kill her after already having solved the quest, you lose the loyalty gain you got for the peaceful solution. But due to not taking into account twon sentiment properly, the bonus was never fully removed. As a solution the optimal approach was to first convince her of the error of her ways, and then to kill her. Which, frankly, shouldn't be a thing. The population shouldn't cheer you most when you convince someone to do something for you and then immediately stab you in the back.

Fixed in r8835.

[Updated on: Sat, 04 July 2020 02:23]




I know now that it could never work between us, as much as we wanted to, it could never be! Not because you're a rabbit, but because you're black.

If you want, you can donate to me. This will not affect how and what I code, and I will not code specific features in return. I will be thankful though.


Re: Absurdly small code changes[message #360500 is a reply to message #360496] Sun, 05 July 2020 15:11 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Flugente

 
Messages:3539
Registered:April 2009
Location: Germany
As you may or may not know, if an insured merc dies, an investigation might be called into the death. There are three reasons for that, with three different results:

  • If the merc died within one hour of finalizing the contract, this counts as 'very suspicious'. You get no payout.

  • If the merc died with no hostiles being in the sector, or if another merc killed them, this counts as 'suspicious'. You get the payout.

  • If several investigations happened earlier, an investigation is called even if the above conditions do not apply. You get the payout.
My issue is with the second one - why the hell does the insurance company pay if we straight off murder a merc to get the insurance money?

So I've changed that. As of r8843 & GameDir r2556, you also get no payout in the second case. If you want to commit insurance fraud, at least put a bit of effort in, dammit!

[Updated on: Sun, 05 July 2020 15:11]




I know now that it could never work between us, as much as we wanted to, it could never be! Not because you're a rabbit, but because you're black.

If you want, you can donate to me. This will not affect how and what I code, and I will not code specific features in return. I will be thankful though.


Re: Absurdly small code changes[message #360551 is a reply to message #360500] Fri, 10 July 2020 19:56 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Flugente

 
Messages:3539
Registered:April 2009
Location: Germany
On longer campaigns, loading savegame can take quite a while. How much exactly, and why?
As of r8856, we now have a small log about that. Time spent is logged in the LoadSavedGame_TimeLog.txt file:

Load savegame: SavedGames\QuickSave.sav
Shutdown stuff								: 0.028000s
LoadTacticalStatusFromSavedGame done					: 0.000000s
LoadLaptopInfoFromSavedGame done					: 0.430000s
LoadSoldierStructure done						: 0.410000s
LoadStrategicInfoFromSavedFile done					: 0.023000s
LoadStrategicMovementGroupsFromSavedGameFile done			: 0.012000s
LoadMapTempFilesFromSavedGameFile done					: 0.123000s
LoadMilitiaMovementInformationFromSavedGameFile done			: 0.205000s
LoadLuaGlobalFromLoadGameFile done					: 0.078000s
File read done								: 0.001000s
Update functions							: 0.035000s
LoadSavedGame total							: 1.345000s
This aren't all the functions we call when loading a savegame - not by a longshot - but seemed natural locations to me.

Hopefully this will allow us to easier track issues with the loading process, as well as allowing us to benchmark possible improvements.



I know now that it could never work between us, as much as we wanted to, it could never be! Not because you're a rabbit, but because you're black.

If you want, you can donate to me. This will not affect how and what I code, and I will not code specific features in return. I will be thankful though.


Re: Absurdly small code changes[message #360601 is a reply to message #360496] Wed, 15 July 2020 18:09 Go to previous messageGo to next message
gougluinn

 
Messages:374
Registered:September 2018
Flugente wrote on Sat, 04 July 2020 02:23
One has two possible solutions to solving the Doreen quest: convincing her to leave peacefully, or killing her. The first solution yields double the loyalty bonus in Drassen.
Sirtech's intention was that if you kill her after already having solved the quest, you lose the loyalty gain you got for the peaceful solution. But due to not taking into account twon sentiment properly, the bonus was never fully removed. As a solution the optimal approach was to first convince her of the error of her ways, and then to kill her. Which, frankly, shouldn't be a thing. The population shouldn't cheer you most when you convince someone to do something for you and then immediately stab you in the back.

Fixed in r8835.
i read somewhere that we can able to recruit loreen. is this possible? if it is then what are the requirements?
Re: Absurdly small code changes[message #360604 is a reply to message #360601] Wed, 15 July 2020 22:53 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Flugente

 
Messages:3539
Registered:April 2009
Location: Germany
Iirc there is some mod where you can recruit pretty much every NPC, so likely Doreen too. Many Mercenaries Mod or something like that. But in stock... nope.



I know now that it could never work between us, as much as we wanted to, it could never be! Not because you're a rabbit, but because you're black.

If you want, you can donate to me. This will not affect how and what I code, and I will not code specific features in return. I will be thankful though.


Re: Absurdly small code changes[message #360606 is a reply to message #360601] Thu, 16 July 2020 09:10 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Hawkeye

 
Messages:2306
Registered:October 2005
Location: Australia
You can recruit Doreen in Deidranna's Side Mod as well as a heap of other bad guys.

http://thepit.ja-galaxy-forum.com/index.php?t=msg&th=24401&start=0&



Re: Absurdly small code changes[message #360608 is a reply to message #360606] Thu, 16 July 2020 20:33 Go to previous messageGo to next message
gougluinn

 
Messages:374
Registered:September 2018
thx for that happy
Re: Absurdly small code changes[message #361399 is a reply to message #348524] Mon, 28 September 2020 17:35 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Kurt

 
Messages:426
Registered:March 2004
Flugente wrote on Fri, 27 January 2017 23:41
I slightly altered the chances for bullets to pass things in r8378 & GameDir r2360:

The AmmoTypes.xml- tag <canGoThrough> has been replaced with <usPiercePersonChanceModifier> (unsigned integer). If value is > 0, a bullet can pierce a person after hitting. Higher values increase the chance to do so. This is the same mechanic as before, only now can we modify the thing.
Is that supposed to work in 8796 SCI?

I can't get it to work, in 8796 the slightest object stops the bullet, which means those heavy anti-material rifles have lost their main interest, the ability to reach out and touch targets behind walls and light cover. They're heavy and expensive, their ammunition is heavy and expensive, but they can go where no other rifle can go...


Flugente wrote on Fri, 27 January 2017 23:41
In case you want to create downright nasty results, set usPiercePersonChanceModifier to 100 and structureImpactReductionMultiplier to 0. Pretty much the only thing stopping these bullets will be Newton suprised
I tried that setting, and my 12.7x108mm rounds didn't even go through one single wall. Which makes me think something is broken.

Note I tried that using a KSVK rifle, on a wall I can routinely shoot through in 3356, aiming at a civilian behind the wall using a thermal visor (yes, SciFi mod), so there is no way I could miss him. I also positioned a merc in the target's room, just in case, to see if the bullet keeps flying on the other side of the wall - It doesn't.

In short, in 8796 any value over 0 for "usPiercePersonChanceModifier" seem to be ignored in-game. speechless



-------- Edited to add:

Found the culprit: Apparently the "anti-material" flag (AmmoFlag 4) does negate the "usPiercePersonChanceModifier". I posted a Bug Report.

[Updated on: Mon, 28 September 2020 18:33]

Re: Absurdly small code changes[message #361875 is a reply to message #350400] Mon, 16 November 2020 23:07 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Seven.

 
Messages:2606
Registered:December 2012
Location: Russian Federation
Flugente wrote on Wed, 26 July 2017 18:49
Another result of this year's convention is a new skill for our mercs: Focus.
I don't think it should be stackable with bonus from watched locations as it plays similar role, in my opinion if focus skill is active, bonus from watched location should be disabled.



7609+AI (r2274) | Experimental project | FAQ | Modpack | Youtube | Trunk (r9216) | 1.13 Starter Docs | 1.13 How to get | Discord


Re: Absurdly small code changes[message #362337 is a reply to message #359075] Mon, 08 February 2021 22:33 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Seven.

 
Messages:2606
Registered:December 2012
Location: Russian Federation
sevenfm wrote on Sat, 22 February 2020 22:13
Looks like new M_STAND.JSD makes hitting enemy swimming in deep water impossible.
silversurfer wrote on Sun, 23 February 2020 03:55
M_STAND.JSD wasn't changed much, except you can now shoot between the legs and N, E, S, W directions are not thicker anymore than the other directions.
Just checked again, with new M_STAND.JSD, it's impossible to hit soldier swimming in deep water in certain directions (facing the shooter) when using OCTH.
https://i.imgur.com/5YYd7TG.png



7609+AI (r2274) | Experimental project | FAQ | Modpack | Youtube | Trunk (r9216) | 1.13 Starter Docs | 1.13 How to get | Discord


Re: Absurdly small code changes[message #363383 is a reply to message #362337] Fri, 18 June 2021 21:55 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Flugente

 
Messages:3539
Registered:April 2009
Location: Germany
A few recent changes that might be interesting:
  • r9079: Ballistic shields are now drawn better under/over a merc. In particular they are no longer drawn over buildings.
  • r9080: Fixed structure damage from anti-materiel bullets. Damage to structures is now detected and applied a lot better, making these rifles more useful.
  • r9084: The contents of a container are no longer destroyed when the container is damaged. Why destroy items inside a crate if the crate still holds?
  • r9087: Related to the above, if a container is destroyed, the items inside are only destroyed if the cause was an explosion. It no longer happens if the cause was an anti-material bullet or vehicle collision. After all decades of videogames have taught me that shooting a crate is a perfectly legitimate way of opening it!
    This also means that an OSV-96 or a Hummer are now lockpicks. You're welcome. happy



I know now that it could never work between us, as much as we wanted to, it could never be! Not because you're a rabbit, but because you're black.

If you want, you can donate to me. This will not affect how and what I code, and I will not code specific features in return. I will be thankful though.


Re: Absurdly small code changes[message #363385 is a reply to message #363383] Sun, 20 June 2021 00:23 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Uriens

 
Messages:342
Registered:July 2006
Now all we need is a way to drag a container to an open street so we can make a roadkill out of it. cheeky
Re: Absurdly small code changes[message #363386 is a reply to message #363385] Sun, 20 June 2021 02:43 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Kitty

 
Messages:324
Registered:October 2017
Location: Germany
Uriens wrote on Sun, 20 June 2021 00:23
Now all we need is a way to drag a container to an open street so we can make a roadkill out of it. cheeky

I think we already can happy Another piece of Flugentes magic:






How to get: latest 1.13, 7609 and more | 7609 SCI (eng) | Compiling+SVN

I need more details. (Didi Hallervorden)
Re: Absurdly small code changes[message #363516 is a reply to message #363386] Thu, 15 July 2021 21:39 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Flugente

 
Messages:3539
Registered:April 2009
Location: Germany
A few more changes that might be interesting and aren't fitting into other threads:

  • r9114: Anti-materiel bullets no longer stop when they damage a structure. This means that a sufficiently damaging bullet can destry several structures in it's path, as seen in a recent video.
  • r9120: Dragging a structure no longer repairs it or removes the new decals placed upon it.
  • r9123: On large roofs the destruction can take a while. It's faster now, but still not perfect.
  • r9123: Fixed a method to accidentally corrupt a savegame by saving map changes that weren't meant to be saved. What happened was that the game tried to save an ongoing animation as a structure, which predictably failed.
  • r9133: Fix: cows left no corpse if they died from a gas attack.
  • r9140: Fix: crash when spreading gas tries to inhabit a tile blocked by a structure.
  • r9144: Whether a gun shoots fire or fire retardant is now set on the ammo with the <ammoflag>-tag, not the gun. In case you haven't noticed, we have fire extinguishers now. I also restored the flamethrower in stock to functionality.
    This change means that theoretically, you could have a gun that either causes or extinguishes fire depending on the type of ammo loaded. This is set in the <ammoflag>-tag in AmmoTypes.xml. The following flags exist:
    <ammoflag>			flagmask for various ammo properties:
    							AMMO_CRYO				1			this ammo shock-freezes target (scifi)
    							AMMO_BLIND				2			this ammo will blind if it hits the head
    							AMMO_ANTIMATERIEL		4			this ammo is anti-materiel, bullets can destroy structures
    							AMMO_TRAIL_WHITESMOKE	8			this ammo leaves a trail of white smoke
    							AMMO_TRAIL_FIRE			16			this ammo leaves a trail of fire
    

    https://i.imgur.com/lAzIBur.png




I know now that it could never work between us, as much as we wanted to, it could never be! Not because you're a rabbit, but because you're black.

If you want, you can donate to me. This will not affect how and what I code, and I will not code specific features in return. I will be thankful though.


Re: Absurdly small code changes[message #363535 is a reply to message #363516] Mon, 26 July 2021 00:04 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Flugente

 
Messages:3539
Registered:April 2009
Location: Germany
Until r9146, when wielding two guns, and one of them ran out of ammunition, clicking on the reload cursor reloaded both of these guns. Even if the other gun wasn't empty. Which quite often is a waste of AP and leaves you with a bunch partially filled magazines in your inventory.

Well, no more of that. Now when reloading from the cursor prompt, we only reload empty guns. Other methods (like [Shift][r]) are not affected.


I also fixed a bug that caused firing cost to be incorrectly deducted twice when firing two guns from several barrels each in r9145. This fix means that, yes, dual-wielding sawed-offs allows you to fire 4 shotgun blasts for the price of 1. Which, frankly, sounds like something out of a DOOM mod.

Have you ever hit a guy's head with 80 flechette darts at point blank? Quite unusual damage numbers confused



I know now that it could never work between us, as much as we wanted to, it could never be! Not because you're a rabbit, but because you're black.

If you want, you can donate to me. This will not affect how and what I code, and I will not code specific features in return. I will be thankful though.


Re: Absurdly small code changes[message #363595 is a reply to message #363535] Sat, 14 August 2021 22:26 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Flugente

 
Messages:3539
Registered:April 2009
Location: Germany
I've rebalanced shotguns and sniper rifles a bit and did a few other balancing things in GameDir r2611. Shotguns first.

Original values:
Name	        Calibre	        Fire AP	CycleAP	ReadyAP	Damage	Range	Acc.	MagSize	ReloadAP Mags	2-handed Barrels Underb. Scope	Auto AP	Rel.	Rep.Ease Price	Coolness
HK CAWS	        CAWS	        40	0	12	48	200	-2	10	24	Yes	Yes	1	No	2	88	0	-3	2513	7
Baikal MP-233B	12 gauge	36	0	17	40	170	0	2	14	No	Yes	2	No	2	0	0	0	1650	3
SPAS-12	        12 gauge	34	0	17	39	160	-1	7	16	No	Yes	1	No	2	0	1	-1	1547	4
Jackhammer	12 gauge	32	0	10	39	155	2	12	40	Yes	Yes	1	No	2	80	0	-4	1960	6
M4 Super 90	12 gauge	35	0	16	39	155	0	7	16	No	Yes	1	No	2	0	2	0	997	4
M3 Convertib	12 gauge	36	0	17	39	155	0	7	16	No	Yes	1	No	2	0	0	1	902	4
USAS-12	        12 gauge	32	0	17	38	150	-1	20	24	Yes	Yes	1	No	2	56	0	0	2010	6
SPAS-15	        12 gauge	34	0	16	38	150	-1	7	24	Yes	Yes	1	No	2	0	0	-2	934	5
Street Sweeper	12 gauge	34	0	16	38	150	-1	12	20	No	Yes	1	No	2	0	0	-2	1820	4
Saiga 12K	12 gauge	35	0	14	38	145	2	7	24	Yes	Yes	1	No	2	0	0	-1	910	5
Hand Mortar	Cannon          47	0	11	50	100	4	1	20	No	No	1	No	1	0	-4	-4	500	2
Sawed-Off	12 gauge	30	0	1	36	90	0	2	14	No	No	2	No	2	0	0	3	1230	3
Super-Shorty	12 gauge	31	9	2	36	95	0	4	16	No	No	1	No	2	0	0	0	1500	4
Ithaca Model 37	12 gauge	34	10	9	38	150	2	4	16	No	Yes	1	No	2	0	0	3	1390	3
KAC Masterkey	12 gauge	34	10	20	36	90	0	4	16	No	Yes	1	Yes	1	0	0	3	1900	5
Neostead	12 gauge	31	12	9	39	160	6	12	14	No	Yes	1	No	2	0	0	-1	1650	5
Baikal MP-133	12 gauge	36	12	16	39	155	0	7	16	No	Yes	1	No	2	0	0	-1	1980	3
Fabarm SDASS	12 gauge	36	12	15	39	155	1	7	16	No	Yes	1	No	2	0	1	1	1460	5
Remington M870	12 gauge	36	12	15	38	150	1	7	16	No	Yes	1	No	2	0	2	3	822	4
Fabarm FP6	12 gauge	34	12	9	38	135	0	4	16	No	Yes	1	No	2	0	1	1	1400	4

New values:
Name	        Calibre	        Fire AP	CycleAP	ReadyAP	Damage	Range	Acc.	MagSize	ReloadAP Mags	2-handed Barrels Underb. Scope	Auto AP	Rel.	Rep.Ease Price	Coolness
HK CAWS	        CAWS	        38	0	16	48	200	2	10	24	Yes	Yes	1	No	2	86	0	-3	4500	9
Baikal MP-233B	12 gauge	36	0	17	40	170	2	2	14	No	Yes	2	No	2	0	5	4	935	3
SPAS-12	        12 gauge	35	0	15	39	160	1	7	16	No	Yes	1	No	2	0	1	-1	1480	5
Jackhammer      12 gauge	36	0	17	39	155	2	12	40	Yes	Yes	1	No	2	84	0	-4	3500	8
M4 Super 90	12 gauge	35	0	14	39	155	0	7	16	No	Yes	1	No	2	0	2	0	1350	5
M3 Convertible	12 gauge	36	0	16	39	155	1	7	16	No	Yes	1	No	2	0	2	1	1300	5
USAS-12	        12 gauge	35	0	17	38	150	-1	20	24	Yes	Yes	1	No	2	59	1	-1	4000	7
SPAS-15	        12 gauge	34	0	16	38	150	1	7	24	Yes	Yes	1	No	2	0	1	-2	1780	6
Street Sweeper	12 gauge	36	0	16	38	150	-2	12	32	No	Yes	1	No	2	0	2	2	1100	5
Saiga 12K	12 gauge	35	0	14	38	145	1	7	24	Yes	Yes	1	No	2	0	0	-1	1700	6
Hand Mortar	Cannon	        47	0	11	50	100	4	1	20	No	No	1	No	1	0	-4	-4	500	2
Sawed-Off 	12 gauge	30	0	3	36	90	-2	2	14	No	No	2	No	2	0	5	4	700	3
Super-Shorty	12 gauge	31	9	3	36	95	0	4	16	No	No	1	No	2	0	2	3	900	4
Ithaca Model 37	12 gauge	34	10	9	38	150	2	4	16	No	Yes	1	No	2	0	2	3	800	3
KAC Masterkey	12 gauge	33	10	12	36	90	0	4	16	No	Yes	1	Yes	1	0	0	3	1600	5
Neostead	12 gauge	36	12	17	39	160	2	12	14	No	Yes	1	No	2	0	1	-3	1300	5
Baikal MP-133	12 gauge	36	12	16	39	155	2	7	16	No	Yes	1	No	2	0	3	2	600	4
Fabarm SDASS	12 gauge	35	12	14	39	155	3	7	16	No	Yes	1	No	2	0	3	1	1000	4
Remington M870	12 gauge	36	12	15	38	150	3	7	16	No	Yes	1	No	2	0	4	3	700	4
Fabarm FP6	12 gauge	33	12	9	38	135	2	4	16	No	Yes	1	No	2	0	3	1	900	3


  • AP values for firing and readying are now more in line with each other.

  • Accuraccy (only OCTH here, I'm not going down the NCTH rabbit hole) no longer have that weird Neostead outlier. Most importantly pump-actions get a bonus so there's something they are good at.

  • Reliability and repair ease have been altered according to what seemed reasonable to me after watching a few online videos and wild guesswork. Again pump-actions profit, in general they seem to be more reliable than semi-autos.

  • There's been arguing for years that the gun prices are whack (Jackhammer costs less than Baikal MP133 ???). It's hard to genuinely put a good price on these things, considering Arulco is a vaguely defined country in a vaguely defined persiod of time, with some of these guns never haven gone beyond prototype stage. I took what seemed reasonable to me compared to other guns.

  • Similarly I adopted coolness so that the more the game progresses, you see deadlier guns appear.

  • One thing I didn't touch but some people might not be fully aware: Guns that don't use Mags reload per bullet. This means that when you reload, you pay the reload AP cost + the reload cost per bullet (AP_RELOAD_LOOSE) * bullets loaded. This is obviously a lot worse than simply reloading a mag.
    However, this has the sideeffect that you get no AP penalty if the ammo item you reload from has a different magsize than the gun. If you reload your sawed-off, it doesn't matter whether you take the bullets from a 12 Gauge Shells, 12 or 12 Gauge Shells, 2 item. This does mean you can carry a few shells extra without paying any additional AP by optimizing your inventory (a vest slot takes 3 7-stacks or 8 2-stacks, so you can carry 5 extra shells by using the first).

[Updated on: Sat, 14 August 2021 22:27]




I know now that it could never work between us, as much as we wanted to, it could never be! Not because you're a rabbit, but because you're black.

If you want, you can donate to me. This will not affect how and what I code, and I will not code specific features in return. I will be thankful though.


Re: Absurdly small code changes[message #363596 is a reply to message #363595] Sat, 14 August 2021 22:55 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Flugente

 
Messages:3539
Registered:April 2009
Location: Germany
Sniper rifles I haven't done all that much so far, I've only changed the coolness so far and changed the M24 & M40A1.

Original values:
Name	        Calibre	       FireAP	CycleAP	ReadyAP	Damage	Range	Acc.	MagSize	ReloadAP Mags	Noise	AntiM.	Scope	Auto AP	Rel.	Rep.Ease Price	Coolness
Gepard M2	12.7x108mm	59	0	32	60	1200	6	5	32	Yes	100	Yes	10	0	0	-3	10640	10
OSV-96	        12.7x108mm	64	0	35	60	1200	9	5	20	Yes	100	Yes	10	0	0	-4	9730	10
Barrett M82A2	.50 BMG	        54	0	19	51	1100	6	10	32	Yes	100	Yes	10	0	2	-1	14671	10
VSSK Vykhlop	12.7x97mm Subs.	54	0	13	49	600	6	5	32	Yes	8	No	10	0	0	-2	9583	10
Barrett M98	.338 Lapua	47	0	21	41	1200	6	10	32	Yes	100	No	10	0	0	0	13658	10
Walther WA 2000	.300 WinMag	28	0	14	39	795	7	5	28	Yes	85	No	10	0	0	-2	7940	9
HK PSG1	        7.62x51mm	29	0	21	39	795	7	20	20	Yes	85	No	10	0	0	-2	8606	9
Dragunov SVD	7.62x54mmR	32	0	19	39	790	7	10	24	Yes	90	No	8	0	0	1	8449	8
Benelli R-1	.300 WinMag	33	0	17	39	785	6	5	32	Yes	85	No	10	0	0	0	7830	7
SVU	        7.62x54mmR	29	0	11	38	750	6	10	28	Yes	77	No	8	0	0	-2	5540	8
Knight SR-25	7.62x51mm	30	0	16	38	780	6	20	20	Yes	85	No	10	0	0	-2	8840	7
HK MSG90A1	7.62x51mm	30	0	20	38	775	6	20	20	Yes	85	No	10	0	2	-2	6030	8
Dragunov SVDS	7.62x54mmR	32	0	19	38	770	7	10	24	Yes	90	No	8	0	0	0	5830	8
M21 Tactical	7.62x51mm	30	0	19	37	755	6	20	20	Yes	85	No	10	0	2	1	5700	7
M21 EBR	        7.62x51mm	30	0	19	37	755	6	20	20	Yes	85	No	10	0	2	1	6685	8
Galil Sniper	7.62x51mm	30	0	18	37	685	6	20	20	Yes	85	No	10	0	1	-1	7240	7
Zastava M76	7.62x51mm	31	0	18	37	750	6	10	20	Yes	85	No	10	0	0	-1	5400	6
HK SL9SD	7.62x37mm	29	0	18	34	300	6	10	20	Yes	2	No	10	0	0	-3	3900	7
VSS Vintorez	9x39mm	        30	0	14	32	400	7	20	24	Yes	5	No	8	42	0	-1	7785	8
VSk-94	        9x39mm	        31	0	15	31	375	6	20	20	Yes	7	No	8	43	-1	-2	4740	8
ColtCanada C7CT	5.56x45mm	26	0	18	30	400	6	30	20	Yes	34	No	10	0	0	-1	5880	6
S&O Shorty	.300 WinMag	28	21	10	39	810	11	5	32	Yes	85	No	10	0	0	-1	7950	7
Blaser R93 LRS2	.300 WinMag	32	23	19	39	780	12	5	32	Yes	85	No	10	0	0	0	7770	7
KSVK	        12.7x108mm	42	28	19	60	1200	9	5	28	Yes	100	Yes	8	0	0	-3	9380	10
Erma SR-100	.338 Lapua	35	28	23	43	1500	9	10	28	Yes	100	No	10	0	0	-3	11920	10
AI AWM	        .338 Lapua	35	28	22	42	1370	11	10	32	Yes	100	No	10	0	0	-4	15452	10
Sako TRG 42	.338 Lapua	36	28	20	42	1380	11	10	36	Yes	100	No	10	0	0	-3	10670	10
DSR-1	        .338 Lapua	33	28	14	41	1290	12	10	28	Yes	100	No	10	0	0	-4	9770	10
CZ 700	        7.62x51mm	30	28	20	39	795	11	10	20	Yes	85	No	10	0	0	-1	8987	8
Steyr SSG-P1	7.62x51mm	31	28	18	39	795	11	5	28	Yes	85	No	10	0	0	-2	5590	9
FR-F2	        7.62x51mm	31	28	21	39	795	11	10	20	Yes	85	No	10	0	0	-2	5640	8
Parker Hale M82	7.62x51mm	32	28	18	39	800	11	5	28	Yes	85	No	10	0	0	0	5590	8
Sako TRG 22	7.62x51mm	32	28	19	39	800	12	10	32	Yes	85	No	10	0	0	-2	5640	8
SV-98	        7.62x54mmR	32	28	20	39	800	10	10	24	Yes	90	No	10	0	-2	-2	5440	7
M24	        7.62x51mm	30	28	19	38	780	12	5	40	Yes	85	No	10	0	0	2	8830	7
Beretta M501	7.62x51mm	31	28	19	38	765	12	5	28	Yes	85	No	10	0	0	-1	8734	7
M40A1	        7.62x51mm	32	28	18	38	780	12	5	40	Yes	85	No	10	0	0	-1	5390	7
Steyr Scout	7.62x51mm	31	28	16	37	615	12	10	28	Yes	85	No	10	0	0	-2	4310	7

New values:
Name	        Calibre	       FireAP	CycleAP	ReadyAP	Damage	Range	Acc.	MagSize	ReloadAP Mags	Noise	AntiM.	Scope	Auto AP	Rel.	Rep.Ease Price	Coolness
Gepard M2	12.7x108mm	59	0	32	60	1200	6	5	32	Yes	100	Yes	10	0	0	-3	10640	10
OSV-96	        12.7x108mm	64	0	35	60	1200	9	5	20	Yes	100	Yes	10	0	0	-4	9730	10
Barrett M82A2	.50 BMG	        54	0	19	51	1100	6	10	32	Yes	100	Yes	10	0	2	-1	14671	10
VSSK Vykhlop	12.7x97mm Subs.	54	0	13	49	600	6	5	32	Yes	8	No	10	0	0	-2	9583	10
Barrett M98	.338 Lapua	47	0	21	41	1200	6	10	32	Yes	100	No	10	0	0	0	13658	9
Walther WA 2000	.300 WinMag	28	0	14	39	795	7	5	28	Yes	85	No	10	0	0	-2	7940	9
HK PSG1	        7.62x51mm	29	0	21	39	795	7	20	20	Yes	85	No	10	0	0	-2	8606	9
Dragunov SVD	7.62x54mmR	32	0	19	39	790	7	10	24	Yes	90	No	8	0	0	1	8449	8
Benelli R-1	.300 WinMag	33	0	17	39	785	6	5	32	Yes	85	No	10	0	0	0	7830	7
SVU	        7.62x54mmR	29	0	11	38	750	6	10	28	Yes	77	No	8	0	0	-2	5540	8
Knight SR-25	7.62x51mm	30	0	16	38	780	6	20	20	Yes	85	No	10	0	0	-2	8840	9
HK MSG90A1	7.62x51mm	30	0	20	38	775	6	20	20	Yes	85	No	10	0	2	-2	6030	9
Dragunov SVDS	7.62x54mmR	32	0	19	38	770	7	10	24	Yes	90	No	8	0	0	0	5830	8
M21 Tactical	7.62x51mm	30	0	19	37	755	6	20	20	Yes	85	No	10	0	2	1	5700	8
M21 EBR	        7.62x51mm	30	0	19	37	755	6	20	20	Yes	85	No	10	0	2	1	6685	9
Galil Sniper	7.62x51mm	30	0	18	37	685	6	20	20	Yes	85	No	10	0	1	-1	7240	8
Zastava M76	7.62x51mm	31	0	18	37	750	6	10	20	Yes	85	No	10	0	0	-1	5400	7
HK SL9SD	7.62x37mm	29	0	18	34	300	6	10	20	Yes	2	No	10	0	0	-3	3900	7
VSS Vintorez	9x39mm	        30	0	14	32	400	7	20	24	Yes	5	No	8	42	0	-1	7785	9
VSk-94	        9x39mm	        31	0	15	31	375	6	20	20	Yes	7	No	8	43	-1	-2	4740	8
ColtCanada C7CT	5.56x45mm	26	0	18	30	400	6	30	20	Yes	34	No	10	0	0	-1	5880	6
S&O Shorty	.300 WinMag	28	21	10	39	810	11	5	32	Yes	85	No	10	0	0	-1	7950	6
Blaser R93 LRS2	.300 WinMag	32	23	19	39	780	12	5	32	Yes	85	No	10	0	0	0	7770	7
KSVK	        12.7x108mm	42	28	19	60	1200	9	5	28	Yes	100	Yes	8	0	0	-3	9380	10
Erma SR-100	.338 Lapua	35	28	23	43	1500	9	10	28	Yes	100	No	10	0	0	-3	11920	9
AI AWM	        .338 Lapua	35	28	22	42	1370	11	10	32	Yes	100	No	10	0	0	-4	15452	9
Sako TRG 42	.338 Lapua	36	28	20	42	1380	11	10	36	Yes	100	No	10	0	0	-3	10670	9
DSR-1	        .338 Lapua	33	28	14	41	1290	12	10	28	Yes	100	No	10	0	0	-4	9770	9
CZ 700	        7.62x51mm	30	28	20	39	795	11	10	20	Yes	85	No	10	0	0	-1	8987	7
FR-F2	        7.62x51mm	31	28	21	39	795	11	10	20	Yes	85	No	10	0	0	-2	5640	7
Steyr SSG-P1	7.62x51mm	31	28	18	39	795	11	5	28	Yes	85	No	10	0	0	-2	5590	8
SV-98	        7.62x54mmR	32	28	20	39	800	10	10	24	Yes	90	No	10	0	-2	-2	5440	6
Sako TRG 22	7.62x51mm	32	28	19	39	800	12	10	32	Yes	85	No	10	0	0	-2	5640	7
Parker Hale M82	7.62x51mm	32	28	18	39	800	11	5	28	Yes	85	No	10	0	0	0	5590	7
M24	        7.62x51mm	30	28	19	38	780	12	5	10	No	85	No	10	0	0	2	8830	6
Beretta M501	7.62x51mm	31	28	19	38	765	12	5	28	Yes	85	No	10	0	0	-1	8734	6
M40A1	        7.62x51mm	32	28	18	38	780	12	5	10	No	85	No	10	0	0	-1	5390	6
Steyr Scout	7.62x51mm	31	28	16	37	615	12	10	28	Yes	85	No	10	0	0	-2	4310	6

  • .338 Lapua guns got lower coolness, as there wasn't really a justification to them having coolness 10. Actually, it might be reasonable to lower the ones that have to be cycled even further down in the future.
  • In general, sniper rifles that need cycling get lower coolness. It's an obvious drawback compared to the semi-autos that is in no way offset by their accuraccy.
  • At the same time, semi-auto 7.62s get higher coolness. The things are pretty much unbeatable except in niche roles, like stealth or antimaterial rifles.
  • The M24 and the M40A1 no longer use magazines, but are reloaded by the bullet. While this is bad, it does justify lowering their coolness. Perhaps even further, come to think about it.
I also removed the damage bonus from 10x/8x/7x scopes. Why the hell would a bullet suddenly do more damage if the gun it was fired from had a scope? Don't give me that 'the shoother obviously used the OP accuraccy to target the part of the enemies' skull that was especially vulnerable to gunfire', that's asinine. Sniper rifles already allow you to reliably perform headshots, it's dumb to buff that even further.
I could go on an aside on how the damage bonus on Sniper trait is also not good, but that leads away from this.

So, uh, yeah. Feedback welcome.



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If you want, you can donate to me. This will not affect how and what I code, and I will not code specific features in return. I will be thankful though.


Re: Absurdly small code changes[message #363597 is a reply to message #363596] Sun, 15 August 2021 00:00 Go to previous messageGo to next message
ShaDoOoW

 
Messages:71
Registered:April 2009
Location: Czech Republic
So you basically hard nerfed the sniper rifles without any compensation except for making them shown sligthly faster (which is kinda irreleavant if player uses high BR setting).

The problem here is that sniper rifles are already really bad and barely viable under NCTH.

Lets recap sniper rifles issues:
- they do offer very long range (80), however we have visibility limited to 35~ tiles, slightly more with binoculars or scope and if the shooter cannot see the target himself he takes huge penalty to chance to hit, in short, we can not shoot at the range they do offer and hit things
- even if we could see at 80 tiles, maps are relatively small and enemies run fast (mainly because they now share player traits and third of them spawns with athletic), so they shortly reduce the distance and get close enough where sniper rifle loses accucary/point
- 10x scope actually makes you hit less if you can see the target yourself (because if sniper sees the target himself it means the target is within the 35~ tiles range and 10x scope starts to get efficient beyond this range), but you usually don't have a possibility to use 7x or 4x scope at all
- all single fire under NCTH has much lower chance to hit which makes sniper rifles to miss 50% even with 95+ mrk, 95+ dex, 5+ explvl, marksman/sniper trait


So I don't see what your change brings to the game except making them worse than they are already. I suppose they might be too good under OCTH, but under NCTH there is already no point using them. My sniper traited mercs performs better with AR than sniper rifle lol.


Note that the numericcal values used in my post were pulled off my ass, I don't play this game for few months now so the values I presented might be off, but you get my point. Also I do know there is the "spotter mechanic", hoever I never even considered it, because why would I use 2 mercs to kill 1 enemy, when I can give weapons to both and increase my chance to killing him that way? In a usual scenario of getting outnumbered, sacrificing one merc is just stupid idea. As for the "focus mechanic", I am aware something like this exists, but didn't figure how to use it. Maybe it makes sniper rifles great again, but is too complicated to use and there are no hints that would point a new player who haven't readed this whole thread to it.

[Updated on: Sun, 15 August 2021 00:02]

Re: Absurdly small code changes[message #363598 is a reply to message #363597] Mon, 16 August 2021 23:07 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Flugente

 
Messages:3539
Registered:April 2009
Location: Germany
Uh... no? Regarding to sniper rifles, if one ignores the coolness values, I made the reloading of 2 guns slower (and more realistic) as well as removed bizarre boni from some attachments. I didn't do any other rebalance for now as I'm unsure on where to go and was hoping some fruitful discussion would spawn.

If sniper rifles are so utterly bad in NCTH, it would be a lot more reasonable to alter the NCTH values to make them hit consistently than to give them an implausible damage boost in case they accidentally hit something. But as nobody has done that in so far, I assume others either don't have that problem or (much more likely) nobody is interested in doing that in stock. Fair enough, I'm not either, as I'm no longer interested in using NCTH.

[Updated on: Mon, 16 August 2021 23:08]




I know now that it could never work between us, as much as we wanted to, it could never be! Not because you're a rabbit, but because you're black.

If you want, you can donate to me. This will not affect how and what I code, and I will not code specific features in return. I will be thankful though.


Re: Absurdly small code changes[message #363608 is a reply to message #363598] Sun, 22 August 2021 10:26 Go to previous messageGo to next message
ShaDoOoW

 
Messages:71
Registered:April 2009
Location: Czech Republic
Flugente wrote on Mon, 16 August 2021 23:07
I didn't do any other rebalance for now as I'm unsure on where to go and was hoping some fruitful discussion would spawn.
So, if the post doesn't agree with your and doesn't praise you for your actions it is not fruitful discussion. Fair enough.


Flugente wrote on Mon, 16 August 2021 23:07
If sniper rifles are so utterly bad in NCTH, it would be a lot more reasonable to alter the NCTH values to make them hit consistently than to give them an implausible damage boost in case they accidentally hit something. But as nobody has done that in so far, I assume others either don't have that problem or (much more likely) nobody is interested in doing that in stock. Fair enough, I'm not either, as I'm no longer interested in using NCTH.
Maybe this is because all balance changes are being rejected by the "big" coders who have access to svn?

Everything that smelled with a balance change was ignored when I sent it to Seven before I managed to get this access myself and then I did not dare to push my changes anyway (plus I never get access to gamedir, only source). There are several modifiucations for NCTH, mercs values or gun values made by "random players", but none of them was ever considered to get into official game dir. From what I see, the only one making any balance changes in years is you and that happens without any consulting with others. You do it, post details here and if someone by any chance objects you call this "unfruitful discussion" and get angry.

Honestly I do not care, nerf sniper rifles to the ground if you want, but do not ask for others opinions if you do not want to hear objections or critique.

[Updated on: Sun, 22 August 2021 10:28]

Re: Absurdly small code changes[message #363609 is a reply to message #363608] Sun, 22 August 2021 10:37 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Seven.

 
Messages:2606
Registered:December 2012
Location: Russian Federation
I think you just need to contact lalienxx to get gamedir access, it's not like someone is prohibiting it.
As for sniper scopes, I'm ok with nerfing them a bit, it's just for OCTH as I understand and I nerfed sniper game A LOT more in +AI and I'm happy with it as most who play with my exe.
I don't remember rejecting any of your balance changes, there was only one commit with the padding code tweak I wasn't sure is 100% good and safe for 1.13.
But I think it's a general rule here, if you do balance changes, post them on forum so people could see and discuss them if they want.
Also, there are mods and personal code branches for that, if you prefer just do something instead of convincing others (like it was for me with my +AI project when a few of my patches were silently ignored by 1.13 main coder whom I sent them).



7609+AI (r2274) | Experimental project | FAQ | Modpack | Youtube | Trunk (r9216) | 1.13 Starter Docs | 1.13 How to get | Discord


Re: Absurdly small code changes[message #363610 is a reply to message #363608] Sun, 22 August 2021 16:16 Go to previous message
Flugente

 
Messages:3539
Registered:April 2009
Location: Germany
ShaDoOoW wrote on Sun, 22 August 2021 07:26
Flugente wrote on Mon, 16 August 2021 23:07
I didn't do any other rebalance for now as I'm unsure on where to go and was hoping some fruitful discussion would spawn.
So, if the post doesn't agree with your and doesn't praise you for your actions it is not fruitful discussion. Fair enough.
I said that I didn't agree with your assessment on what these changes do. I don't recall objecting to your post in principle.

ShaDoOoW wrote on Sun, 22 August 2021 07:26

Flugente wrote on Mon, 16 August 2021 23:07
If sniper rifles are so utterly bad in NCTH, it would be a lot more reasonable to alter the NCTH values to make them hit consistently than to give them an implausible damage boost in case they accidentally hit something. But as nobody has done that in so far, I assume others either don't have that problem or (much more likely) nobody is interested in doing that in stock. Fair enough, I'm not either, as I'm no longer interested in using NCTH.
Maybe this is because all balance changes are being rejected by the "big" coders who have access to svn?

Everything that smelled with a balance change was ignored when I sent it to Seven before I managed to get this access myself and then I did not dare to push my changes anyway (plus I never get access to gamedir, only source). There are several modifiucations for NCTH, mercs values or gun values made by "random players", but none of them was ever considered to get into official game dir. From what I see, the only one making any balance changes in years is you and that happens without any consulting with others. You do it, post details here and if someone by any chance objects you call this "unfruitful discussion" and get angry.

Honestly I do not care, nerf sniper rifles to the ground if you want, but do not ask for others opinions if you do not want to hear objections or critique.
So if someone answers to my posts and I disagree with their conclusions, me pointing that out is bad? So what, I should just put in what anyone tells me to?



I know now that it could never work between us, as much as we wanted to, it could never be! Not because you're a rabbit, but because you're black.

If you want, you can donate to me. This will not affect how and what I code, and I will not code specific features in return. I will be thankful though.


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