Home » JAGGED ALLIANCE 3 » JA 3 General Talk » Is it worth it? (Is JA3 worth buying?)
Is it worth it?[message #365494] Thu, 20 July 2023 00:44 Go to next message
Dr-D is currently offline Dr-D

 
Messages:102
Registered:July 2005
Location: Portugal
I know we are in a world stage where everyone is a critic. But in general, is JA3 worth our money?

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Sergeant
Re: Is it worth it?[message #365496 is a reply to message #365494] Thu, 20 July 2023 01:29 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Brms08

 
Messages:35
Registered:June 2008
Dr-D wrote on Thu, 20 July 2023 00:44
I know we are in a world stage where everyone is a critic.
Which surely includes critics of the critics.


Dr-D wrote on Thu, 20 July 2023 00:44
But in general, is JA3 worth our money?
That is not a question that can be answered collectively, as we neither have a common bank account or common tastes.

Is it worth my money? I wouldn't pay more than 10 bucks for it as a separate game, not as a JA2 sequel. Can be entertaining for a while, if you're only looking for a "Jagged Alliance" type of game.

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Private 1st Class
Re: Is it worth it?[message #365497 is a reply to message #365496] Thu, 20 July 2023 01:36 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Dr-D is currently offline Dr-D

 
Messages:102
Registered:July 2005
Location: Portugal
Thanks for the useful last paragraph.

So, in the scale of all JA games and pseudo games, where would you put it? Better than "back in action"?

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Sergeant
Re: Is it worth it?[message #365498 is a reply to message #365497] Thu, 20 July 2023 03:21 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Brms08

 
Messages:35
Registered:June 2008
Dr-D wrote on Thu, 20 July 2023 01:36
So, in the scale of all JA games and pseudo games, where would you put it? Better than "back in action"?
Definitely worse than JA2, probably more entertaining than JA at this point. Can't comment on any other title in the series, never played them.

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Private 1st Class
Re: Is it worth it?[message #365499 is a reply to message #365494] Thu, 20 July 2023 08:44 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Shadooow is currently offline Shadooow

 
Messages:109
Registered:April 2009
Location: Czech Republic
Dr-D wrote on Wed, 19 July 2023 23:44
I know we are in a world stage where everyone is a critic. But in general, is JA3 worth our money?
Reasons to try it:
- you a fan of turn-based games
- you are a casual fan of Jagged Alliance (you played it long time ago, you still remember it being good)
- you like arcade style of gameplay, or rather you don't care about realism
- you are rich enough to not wink an eye over 45€
- you are very optimistic in nature big grin

Why not to try it:
- you are hardcode JA2 fan who likes the things as they are in JA2
- you have experiences with mod JA2 1.13 and all its goodies
- you are realism freak - you want to play maximally realistic game like Commandos

Imo these days 45$ is not that much, unlike other newer games it is one time payment, not a monthly fee and there are no microtransactions and battle passes. It is likely there will be DLCs later to buy separately, but hopefully that will be in form of classic expansion.

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Sergeant
Re: Is it worth it?[message #365503 is a reply to message #365499] Thu, 20 July 2023 09:27 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Melliores is currently offline Melliores

 
Messages:15
Registered:February 2012
Jagged Alliance 3 is definitely worth it. Some highlights:

- fluid gameplay, where Overwatch and Interrupt actually work great. Friendly fire is a thing and you need to be careful about it. Elevation and destroyable environment also plays a big role - you can climb onto a watch tower or hide behind a car, that doesn't mean they won't be destroyed and hurt you.
- the colourful characters and unapologetic humour are back in full force. Sometimes they can be over the top but in general they have the Jagged Alliance feel. Merc interactions are an integral part of the game.
- modding weapons is even easier and more interesting than the previous games. That said, it does have its own quirks. The weapon modification system can be improved upon but overall it is more intuitive and impactful even than the one in JA2 1.13 (in my humble opinion).
- the game features modding support right from the get go. There are already mods for it and modding tools are planned for release next month. Within this year they will also release a campaign and map editor making it really easy for anyone with the skills and motivation to create their own custom campaign. We will be able to recreate JA1 and JA2 if we want to.
- maps are gorgeous and have some nice elevation and cover features on them. Most of them are on the small side but the game does feature proper big maps. Some of the big maps are incredible and just show that the game's engine does support bigger maps, you just need to bear in mind the performance hit of more enemies and civilians on the map.
- the musical score is remarkable and does a lot to bring back that Jagged Alliance atmosphere. A bit on the positive side but very much African in vibe.
- the game has a coop mode, much like Jagged Alliance Deadly games. You can enjoy it with a friend, a wife or your kid and have a good time.

Now, there are some questionable changes that you might not like:
- inventory is changed and now has a shared squad stash for ammo. Instead of weight, each character has a number of inventory slots that depend on their strength. The number of equipment slots is also more limited.
- armour does not show on your characters or enemies. Only weapons are portrayed on the the tactical map. That said, the art is masterfully done, yet the art style might not be to everyone's liking.
- shops and traders are at best rudimentary. There is no Bobby Ray's online. You have to live of the land and conserve ammo and explosives. You can still go full guns blazing on a couple of key battles but you won't be able to sustain this gameplay for an extended period of time.
- due to their being no traditional shops, you won't be able to make much money (if at all) from selling loot. This makes mines, diamonds and other valuables key to financing your war effort. This change of pace might not be to everyone's taste.
- there is a crafting system for ammo and explosives but that also is still only bare-bones. It was intended to help with the lack of traders but most of the ingredients are also hard to come by. It can alleviate to certain degree the ammo shortage for specific calibers but it is in need of a balance pass.

[Updated on: Thu, 20 July 2023 09:33]

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Private
Re: Is it worth it?[message #365506 is a reply to message #365503] Thu, 20 July 2023 16:41 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Skott Karlsson is currently offline Skott Karlsson

 
Messages:79
Registered:May 2001
Location: Oldsmar, FL. USA
My early impression but not my final is as follows. Its not a terrible game but its not great either. At best its just okay. This is probably the best attempt a developer has come to making a good sequel to JA2. Not saying the game itself is good but the attempt thus far. Once I finish the game I can give a better answer. What might make this a good game is what the modding community can do with it. If they can do anything with it. We'll have to wait and see about that.

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Corporal
Re: Is it worth it?[message #365509 is a reply to message #365506] Thu, 20 July 2023 18:23 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Mravac Kid is currently offline Mravac Kid

 
Messages:68
Registered:May 2004
Location: Opatija, Croatia
I'd say wait for it to be on sale, but that goes for pretty much any game. happy It's certainly worth playing.
And of course once the modders get into it "properly", I'm sure there'll be a lot of improvements making it even more worthwhile.



Ride The Wild Wind - Push the Envelope, don't Sit on the Fence
Ride The Wild Wind - Live Life on the Razor's Edge

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Corporal
Re: Is it worth it?[message #365526 is a reply to message #365509] Sat, 22 July 2023 23:06 Go to previous messageGo to next message
flybyu

 
Messages:44
Registered:August 2005
Location: Indiana U.S.A
It's fun but needs lots of modding done to make it right.  Firearms names, calibers,  damage, more enemies,  and on and on.

I'm waiting for someone to fix the damage done and Firearms names and the right ammunition for the proper weapons.  They have for example. G48 8mm using 7.62x51mm, and the SVD Dragunov using 7.62x39mm.

Mod away it's in great need.

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Corporal
Re: Is it worth it?[message #365529 is a reply to message #365494] Sat, 22 July 2023 23:51 Go to previous messageGo to next message
rooock is currently offline rooock

 
Messages:5
Registered:July 2012
i have downloaded like 30 games over the last month. But i kept playing same two ive always played.

when i downloaded ja3, at first i was taken back by graphics, it was kind of kiddy, but within 20 minutes you realize ja2 DNA runs through.

yes its worth it now im having so much fun 7 hours later, i am actually happy and excited to play a game again. Biggest thing by far for me are

1. destructuble environment. its SO awesome -you shoot and covers get blown apart, hell i was on a roof and a guy kept shooting at it and i feel through the roof down sustaining injury!! its amazing.

2. extra special attacks. overwatch adds a huge dynamic but also other cool stuff.



i bought the game to support the devs. I refused to play anything since ja2 and i can tell you this game is very well done. Mods will come out in droves for it so replay ability will be huge. Theyre already working on custom maps making.

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Private
Re: Is it worth it?[message #365532 is a reply to message #365494] Sun, 23 July 2023 04:47 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Auran is currently offline Auran

 
Messages:16
Registered:October 2021
the only thing really destroying it for me is the cheating scumbag AI that casually walks though 5 overwatch cones to melee attack me for 90+ dmg causing an instant kill. i saved scummed the shit out of it and always got a similar result. i want melee to be viable but thats just stupid.

same with "bosses" i had pierre flanked on 5 sides for over 4 turns, he was too armored to damage much so i was hitting eyes/hands etc to debuff him and he'd still never miss and usually 1/2 shot one of my mercs.

whats the point of strategy when nothing works

also the attrition feels off, even save scumming and having great sector results im struggling to keep up enough meds to heal wounds and early on even enough money

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Private
Re: Is it worth it?[message #365533 is a reply to message #365532] Sun, 23 July 2023 13:20 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Gopan is currently offline Gopan

 
Messages:378
Registered:June 2016
Location: Norway
There is no such thing as save-scumming. Saving is part of the game and maybe that's why they made it so difficult, to FORCE people to use the save function. Forget Ironman nonsense, save, save, save and reload, reload, it's a safety measure. Forget realism, it's a game. Not saving in a game doesn't mean that you are brave, that exists only in real life, in the game you save. I am playing my first game in JA3, on easy AND with Forgiving mode on and still i get my ass kicked and almost lost 2 of my soldiers.


Nipson anomimata mi monan opsin

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Master Sergeant
Re: Is it worth it?[message #365534 is a reply to message #365533] Sun, 23 July 2023 13:40 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Shadooow is currently offline Shadooow

 
Messages:109
Registered:April 2009
Location: Czech Republic
Gopan wrote on Sun, 23 July 2023 12:20
There is no such thing as save-scumming. Saving is part of the game and maybe that's why they made it so difficult, to FORCE people to use the save function. Forget Ironman nonsense, save, save, save and reload, reload, it's a safety measure. Forget realism, it's a game. Not saving in a game doesn't mean that you are brave, that exists only in real life, in the game you save. I am playing my first game in JA3, on easy AND with Forgiving mode on and still i get my ass kicked and almost lost 2 of my soldiers.
I doubt that endlessly reloading every turn until you get RNG you want (save-scumming) is intended gameplay...

I used to reload a lot in past when I was new to JA2, in my latest replays I was trying to play more sane and smarter. I was still saving during tactical combat in case some issue happens or I need to leave my computer, but I was not reloading the combat. If it turned out too bad and I lost mercs I was not willing to sacrifice then I replayed the battle from start again.

The whole game just lasts longer if you play it this way and the satisfaction for winning is also bigger. But suits yourself, if you can't beat the game in any other way...

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Sergeant
Re: Is it worth it?[message #365535 is a reply to message #365534] Sun, 23 July 2023 15:41 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Mravac Kid is currently offline Mravac Kid

 
Messages:68
Registered:May 2004
Location: Opatija, Croatia
Here's a pretty good review from Youtube, as seen from a perspective of someone who's not a die-hard JA fan.




Ride The Wild Wind - Push the Envelope, don't Sit on the Fence
Ride The Wild Wind - Live Life on the Razor's Edge

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Corporal
Re: Is it worth it?[message #365539 is a reply to message #365535] Sun, 23 July 2023 16:49 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Auran is currently offline Auran

 
Messages:16
Registered:October 2021
i hate save scumming and i only do it when i feel literally cheated. so really it has nothing to do with difficulty, mostly i find this game quite easy now but moments like that arent bad RNG or difficulty but bad game design.

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Private
Re: Is it worth it?[message #365541 is a reply to message #365539] Sun, 23 July 2023 18:51 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Brms08

 
Messages:35
Registered:June 2008
I'm not sure if this factually correct but from what I've seen the game seems to give increasing amounts of free movement to the enemy when you increase the difficulty. If this is indeed the case I wouldn't play the game at a difficulty level higher than the easiest cause it's super unfair and completely unrealistic in my opinion.

Edit:

Never mind, looks like that is indeed the case.

Quote:
Do you feel like enemies are running twice as fast as your mercs? This is not just your feeliing: on top difficulty they have 60% bonus to free move. IMHO it is just not fun, cause it breaks tactical combat dividing it into two phases: long range sniping -> close combat. No middle distance battle.
Mod decreases enemies 60% free move bonus to 20% for MI, and from 30% to 10% for Commando.
https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=3007139970&searchtext=enemy

I have no interest in fixing shitty games with mods. Hard pass.

[Updated on: Sun, 23 July 2023 19:05]

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Private 1st Class
Re: Is it worth it?[message #365543 is a reply to message #365534] Sun, 23 July 2023 22:28 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Gopan is currently offline Gopan

 
Messages:378
Registered:June 2016
Location: Norway
Don't know what RNG is. I have seen comments here and on Youtube, from people who complain for lack of hard or quicksaves in games. They hate the fact that they have to go back and replay hours of the game or even restarting a chapter, it makes you lose motivation for the game. But when the developers do add the save functions, people are calling it scumming, as if it's something iffy. And i have beaten any game that i like to play, repeatedly, i just don't rush it. I save often so i don't have to go waaaaaaay back in the story. I never said that i save cause i cannot beat the game otherwise. As people are saying "Better to be safe than sorry".

If there is one thing that bugs me, it's that wire cutters and lockpicks cannot be repaired so you have to always be on the lookout for them. Haven't gone far in the story yet, just started my first game, there may be ways to find/buy more or a mod to allow for repairing them.

[Updated on: Tue, 25 July 2023 06:21]




Nipson anomimata mi monan opsin

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Master Sergeant
Re: Is it worth it?[message #365544 is a reply to message #365543] Mon, 24 July 2023 03:52 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Auran is currently offline Auran

 
Messages:16
Registered:October 2021
i agree you definitely need quick saves in games if only for convenience but thats not what save scumming is.

Save scumming is when you reload a single point multiple times to get a favorable outcome.  basically just loading for good RNG. Thats what breaks the game for me and its not really optional because if the enemies are one shotting my mercs from cheap/unrealistic/cheating mechanics then you have to load otherwise you'll quickly have no mercs and not be able to progress in the game. this is why i call it bad game design.

if i just have an unfavorable outcome i dont mind and wont load as it creates interesting gameplay and choices.

to give another example there was a "boss" who counterattacks when damaged with a shotgun, so i sniped him from a screen away, elevated and behind cover and his counterattacks still hit causing wounds and bleeding. this is just stupid

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Private
Re: Is it worth it?[message #365551 is a reply to message #365494] Tue, 25 July 2023 01:58 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Kitty

 
Messages:419
Registered:October 2017
Location: Germany
From what I pick up, most people seem to enjoy it

a few oddities, which is within my expectations for just released

mods so far are a dime a dozen. besides a few usefull QoL-ones, it's random ware. so better be waiting to when those modding tools get released to see something more promising stuff

[Updated on: Tue, 25 July 2023 01:59]




How to get: latest 1.13, 7609 and more | 7609 SCI (eng) | Compiling+SVN

I need more details. (Didi Hallervorden)

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Master Sergeant
Re: Is it worth it?[message #365552 is a reply to message #365544] Tue, 25 July 2023 06:26 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Gopan is currently offline Gopan

 
Messages:378
Registered:June 2016
Location: Norway
[i agree you definitely need quick saves in games if only for convenience but thats not what save scumming is. Save scumming is when you reload a single point multiple times to get a favorable outcome.  basically just loading for good RNG./quote]


Sorry about that, i was trying to use the quote function. Yes, i save my progress for convenience and because i don't like to bang my head on the wall when something very bad happens (exciting however,lol, live and learn happy ) and i've had to abort the game, cause i needed to sleep before going to work the next morning, couldn't dedicate another 6 hours to get to that same point. Thank you for the clarification and since i still don't know what RNG means, could you please enlighten me on that ?

 And to confess my sin, i don't go the save scumming in any game, except when i start a new JA2 game. I try to have most of the starting mercs available, if not all of them. Don't know if that counts as save scumming since i do not save, i just start a new game every time until i get a favorable outcome.

[Updated on: Tue, 25 July 2023 06:35]




Nipson anomimata mi monan opsin

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Master Sergeant
Re: Is it worth it?[message #365553 is a reply to message #365552] Tue, 25 July 2023 13:07 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Auran is currently offline Auran

 
Messages:16
Registered:October 2021
RNG meaning random number genertator or basically just loading for good luck, for instance you could save and reload until an enemy misses or you get a crit etc. or in my case trying to avoid being one shot from max health through multiple layers of defence angry

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Private
Re: Is it worth it?[message #365583 is a reply to message #365553] Sat, 29 July 2023 03:32 Go to previous messageGo to next message
tako_muro is currently offline tako_muro

 
Messages:14
Registered:October 2016
Location: Middle of Sout East or Ea...
It is worth it if you earn easy money. It is too simple compared to -even- JA2 1.12 TBH; best sniper rifle is 12.7 mm bolt-action AMR and its range is 40, best AR is 5.56mm G36 and its range is 36; do the math. There are only 5-6 weapons for every class (Pistol, SMG, AR, Rifle, MG, Heavies). Something very wrong with Stealth, something crucial is missing; combat also feels wrong, so bland compared to JA2 1.12; UI and interaction with mercs feels amateurish compared to JA2 1.12. Now most mercs have unique talents for some reason, it is not a good thing IMHO. Someone has ability to hide better than others for example but he can't teach this talent to others, why? Because they are not human beings anymore.

It has nice graphics though.

I can add many more negative crap but I don't want to keep beating a dead horse, it is enough reason for me to accept the game as soulless JA. Some say it is easy to mod, so I'm going to pray Lady Luck, Game God, Hephaestus and Minerva to inspire people... people like -old and new- developers of 1.13.

[Updated on: Sat, 29 July 2023 03:36]

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Private
Re: Is it worth it?[message #365589 is a reply to message #365583] Sun, 30 July 2023 21:21 Go to previous messageGo to next message
dethica is currently offline dethica

 
Messages:43
Registered:September 2009
there is no pleasing the bear's pit crowd.
ja3 is a good turn based strategy game. as a jagged alliance game it is definitely above average (considering JA:BIA and Flashback exist) and worth picking up.
there is no money to be made with JA style games, so it definitely feels like a labour of love.

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Corporal
Re: Is it worth it?[message #365590 is a reply to message #365589] Sun, 30 July 2023 22:01 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Lepidosteus is currently offline Lepidosteus

 
Messages:95
Registered:November 2007
Location: Land of Buns.
dethica wrote on Sun, 30 July 2023 21:21
there is no pleasing the bear's pit crowd.
ja3 is a good turn based strategy game. as a jagged alliance game it is definitely above average (considering JA:BIA and Flashback exist) and worth picking up.
there is no money to be made with JA style games, so it definitely feels like a labour of love.
I'm sure there's plenty of bears that enjoys JA3. The "GAME BAD :(((" Waldorf and Statlers tend to be loud.

Also, the game peaked at #8 on most sold and had 20k concurrent players on Steam which is huge.
Haemimont mentioned that it's their most successful game ever.
They made a lot of dough already  :)

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Corporal 1st Class
Re: Is it worth it?[message #365593 is a reply to message #365590] Mon, 31 July 2023 10:34 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Shanga is currently offline Shanga

 
Messages:3482
Registered:January 2000
Location: Danubia
In 23 years the franchise has attracted entire generations with different wants and needs. It is normal that we're not seeing things as a block.

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Captain
Re: Is it worth it?[message #365775 is a reply to message #365494] Sat, 23 September 2023 01:38 Go to previous messageGo to next message
B1TM4ST3R

 
Messages:7
Registered:September 2023
Its a modernized version of Jagged Alliance i would say and being a huge fan of JA2 i can say that i generally enjoyed it and wasn't left disappointed. I would love to see the guys behind 1.13 revamp the guns and add a tonne load of new gear in that would truly be amazing..

That being said, I would of enjoyed it more if the side quests (and main ones as well for that matter) didn't tell you EXACTLY where to go, hunting Flay and the "Teddy Bear Killer" doesn't add for much suspense when you are just blatantly told where to go.. I think i even found out where the Major was "hiding" after just casually asking somebody at the start.. Alot of the time I would just be bombarded with a bunch of markers for side quests without even knowing really how they came about or what not..  Huge annoyance for me was the inability to plant explosives normally you have to "throw" them.. I went back to JA2 after an update they released totally ruined the game for me.. I told them in a bug report that i had found out that explosives will not damage walls in "The Good Place" on a reload (meaning you can't lay down your explosives and save).. Next thing i know they had made it so explosives didn't damage walls AT ALL lol and then being told by some little fanboy that "you aren't supposed to be able to destroy walls on that map" (ok right because being able to blow some up but not others isn't game breaking at all) It pissed me off alot i have to say maybe the game will be in a better state further down the road but i will say that their updates they released just totally ruined my experience of playing.. All of a sudden mercs were getting popped with headshots and then straight away they were yawning and saying its time for beddie byes lol.. On reloads as well there would be some ridiculous "trap alarm triggered" which instigated an endless loop of glitched tedium..

But i digress i generally had a good time playing it until their updates started to make me think they didn't know what they were doing. Needs a Bobby Ray's as well, i will just throw it out there again and hope that the good people behind 1.13 add in a tonne load of gear and guns..

Just thought of something else as well, would be great to see Carmen Dancio Modded in! Feels like a copout that there is so much missing, but its still a good game though regardless.. Top tip to anyone playing: just give Ice a Minimi and watch him take down entire squadrons in under a turn!

[Updated on: Sat, 23 September 2023 01:57]

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Private
Re: Is it worth it?[message #365803 is a reply to message #365494] Tue, 24 October 2023 22:48 Go to previous message
Moonshine is currently offline Moonshine
Messages:1
Registered:October 2023
I stand by the "not a sequel to OUR sequel: clause, it's a pretty relaxing tactical game, if ur hardcore about the 2, then something will fell like it's missing (website content)

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