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Re: Game world and mapmaking[message #127153] Thu, 17 August 2006 22:44 Go to previous messageGo to next message
the scorpion

 
Messages:1836
Registered:September 2004
Location: CH
buildings tab, locks, right click on existing locks, set trap type to zero and uncheck the "locked" flag

i guess deleting isn`t possible so we`ll work around and clean up all those wildfire templates...
Re: Game world and mapmaking[message #127154] Sat, 19 August 2006 07:43 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Vicky

 
Messages:66
Registered:January 2006
Location: New Zealand
If there is a very user-friendly, easy to use map-making programme I might be able to give you a hand.. If not maybe I'll just stick to voicing..
Re: Game world and mapmaking[message #127155] Sat, 19 August 2006 08:43 Go to previous messageGo to next message
the scorpion

 
Messages:1836
Registered:September 2004
Location: CH
the tool i use is the beta editor

many people will comlain that it`s not userfriednly nor easy to use, but in fact, it's a matter of giving it some try, trial and error

http://ja2mods.de/page/index.html

ja2beta95.de is the tool

easiest way of learning is too open existing maps and have a look at them. Be sure to run the programme from the .bat file provided in the download. feel free to post any experiences, questions or advice in this thread, these htreads here are not only for me to hold monologues.

this is also meant for everybody who wants to try out mapping ja2. Using custom maps wil greatly improve gaming experience Wink
Re: Game world and mapmaking[message #127156] Sat, 19 August 2006 10:33 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Vicky

 
Messages:66
Registered:January 2006
Location: New Zealand
I know ill be missing something but it doesnt seem to work after i extracted it. Do i need to extract it to somewhere special?
Re: Game world and mapmaking[message #127157] Sat, 19 August 2006 11:57 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Vicky

 
Messages:66
Registered:January 2006
Location: New Zealand
Okay extracted it correctly and now its (kind of) working. Problem is it cannot find any of the tilesets from JA and basically crashes whenever i try do anything..

I installed it over my friends JA game so I really should get it working to make it worthwhile..

edit: Scorpion, made a very nice 'island'/moat map but as soon we tried to add weapons for the enemies or save it crashed.. If anyone can help this problem then the map should be done pretty quickly.. Always loved the idea of some sort of amphibious assult. Someone can always take this idea and make it themslves if they want. They'd probably do it more justice than me since its my first map..
Re: Game world and mapmaking[message #127158] Sat, 19 August 2006 20:25 Go to previous messageGo to next message
the scorpion

 
Messages:1836
Registered:September 2004
Location: CH
hmmm

it seems, you're encountering similar problems as Az, maybe it has to do with ja2 versions, however for me it made no difference running it "over" gold or old ja2 german versions. and since your mss32.dll works as well, this can't be the cause either

what do you mean by "cannot find any of the tilesets from Ja2" ? the editor can't load them? or else?

i guess you did run it from the .bat batch file so it *should* be stable...

which it obviously isnt't
Re: Game world and mapmaking[message #127159] Sat, 19 August 2006 21:17 Go to previous messageGo to next message
AZAZEL

 
Messages:750
Registered:February 2004
Scorpion,
need your input here, stat.
Guess I'm spamming too many images here already, but this time it's a backup solution, in case you don't read the maps,'cause I placed enemies and some civilians too this time.Even played the right one, a bridge, road and private beach(spa),chaises-longues and towels on the sand, flanking regulars and mean elite sniper on a veranda...

http://xrmb2.net/img/images/203404.jpeg

The map on the left is an attempt to make things a little different, that's why water edges don't look like in the finished map-didn't bothered.A little piece of road could unite the two of them, too.

Anyway, the question is: do I keep forcing those tilesets to show what they weren't intended for, or stick with normal diagonal orientation of the map??

Have a repulsion for originality at all costs, but this time it might be worth it!Especially that there's also another harbour to be designed to complete these 2 maps.
PS:can't think of any reason why you could not load the 2 maps, but in case "world info updated" matters and it's not updated for you, please try renaming them.

Re: Game world and mapmaking[message #127160] Sat, 19 August 2006 22:12 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Vicky

 
Messages:66
Registered:January 2006
Location: New Zealand
You've got email scorpion, I'll play around with the editor later on my other computer so i dont ruin any more of my friends games. For now i am busy trying to get vengeance to work.. just as usuccessfully as the editor though..
Re: Game world and mapmaking[message #127161] Sat, 19 August 2006 22:48 Go to previous messageGo to next message
AZAZEL

 
Messages:750
Registered:February 2004
@vicky
Make a separate install of the game from CD.Then instal the editor from ja2mods.de (unzip in your ja2 folder).
After,make sure you have custom RR tilesets(in data/tilesets) and ja2set.dat in data/bynarydata, to use customs, or Scorpy's editor won't read them.( the dude has at least 4 separate installs with editor in his machine, and neither of them reads original tilesets anymore-very strange)I suppose the 1.13 code interferes with that somewhere.

Vengeance needs GERMAN.SLF in data folder(the same as the editor,but the editor has a sligtly different german.slf-not sure they are compatible). The extension mss32.dll might not be the same, too.

So,don't make a cocktail of all things you have; don't...your boyfriend's game, edit maps in another ja2 instalation.
It will take some getting used to, but I'm sure you'll get the hang of it.
Cheers.

Re: Game world and mapmaking[message #127162] Sun, 20 August 2006 02:09 Go to previous messageGo to next message
the scorpion

 
Messages:1836
Registered:September 2004
Location: CH
wow much activity here. vicky in case you didn`t already receive the german.slf file i have it zipped and will email it to you. Yes, custom tilesets would be needed if you want to make the maps for RR. However, first we want your editor to start working, we can bother about tilesets later on, okay?

Looks interesting Az. i'll check that out
Re: Game world and mapmaking[message #127163] Mon, 21 August 2006 05:41 Go to previous messageGo to next message
the scorpion

 
Messages:1836
Registered:September 2004
Location: CH
made some new snow maps. actually, there's lotsa versatility in the custom snow town tileset as well as the adjoining snow/grass mix tileset

maybe i'll add afew more of those
Re: Game world and mapmaking[message #127164] Mon, 21 August 2006 22:41 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Vicky

 
Messages:66
Registered:January 2006
Location: New Zealand
Just need to get a clean install on my other computer so waiting on the install disc.. Really need to get myself a copy.. I'm sure I'll get the editor going this time. I just realised I didnt have the ja play disc in when trying to get it to work which may have made a difference? Will play around anyways.
Re: Game world and mapmaking[message #127165] Tue, 22 August 2006 00:04 Go to previous messageGo to next message
the scorpion

 
Messages:1836
Registered:September 2004
Location: CH
for me i don't require the ja2 disc for playing or using the editor. the damn editor is a tricky beast, maybe it takes some looking around to find a version that works well for you. kaiden has been working on a new editor too. we can hope for that...
Re: Game world and mapmaking[message #127166] Tue, 22 August 2006 18:15 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Vicky

 
Messages:66
Registered:January 2006
Location: New Zealand
Quote:
Originally posted by AZAZEL:
@vicky
Make a separate install of the game from CD.Then instal the editor from ja2mods.de (unzip in your ja2 folder).
After,make sure you have custom RR tilesets(in data/tilesets) and ja2set.dat in data/bynarydata, to use customs, or Scorpy's editor won't read them.
Does the ja2set.dat come later? I'm a little confused..
Re: Game world and mapmaking[message #127167] Tue, 22 August 2006 18:58 Go to previous messageGo to next message
the scorpion

 
Messages:1836
Registered:September 2004
Location: CH
ja2set.dat?

have you managed to get the editor running?

in that case we can continue to install custom tilesets now. I'd have to send you the tilesets and the ja2set.dat

but as long as you're not yet using custom tilesets, this isn't urgent. i can provide the necessary files but they aren't requirements, so if the editor don't work, it's not due to lacking these files.
Re: Game world and mapmaking[message #127168] Tue, 22 August 2006 20:25 Go to previous messageGo to next message
the scorpion

 
Messages:1836
Registered:September 2004
Location: CH
az

when i tried entering one of your maps (h1,slightly edited) the game exited with a strange error message that i haven't seen before

n2 o1 work though, will test g1 as well and mabye delete some more stuff to get it back working

or do you know what could be the difference between your older maps (g1 h1) and the latest ones ou sent me?

*edit*

both maps don't load in the game but do in the editor. the error message is not the one that we have if tiles are missing

but i'll test if the tilesets are the problem and inform then
Re: Game world and mapmaking[message #127169] Tue, 22 August 2006 23:08 Go to previous messageGo to next message
AZAZEL

 
Messages:750
Registered:February 2004
vicky,
You do not need custom tilesets for now.You only need a fresh instal of JA2 and the editor we're using unzipped in the JA2 folder.It is extremely stable that way for us.After unfolding the zip archive that contains the editor in the JA2 folder(allowing it to overwrite existing files),
search in the folder for a 1kb file called
"JA2Editor
MS-DOS Batch File"
Double click on it to launch the editor.
Then explore the functions.
There is no manual(instructions) for that editor, AFAIK,but Wodan wrote one for the Map Editor that the MODSQUAD released with the tools they used for Urban Chaos.Functions are the same, but I would not recommend using that one: it is only stable in conjuction with UB weapon mod, otherwise it will always crash.To tell the truth, I still don't know or use all the functions and features of the tool...Anyway, I may still have that manual burned on a CD, I'll serch for it and send it to Scorp, to send it to you.

@scorpion
I have no idea.
Something like that happened to me too some weeks ago, but after pressing ESC to exit, I relaunched the editor and loaded the map in question with no problem and no protests from the program :whoknows:
After numerous tries I think I found a way to picture those dock edges in a satisfactory way.
http://xrmb2.net/img/images/123038.jpeg
Custom tropical port used.
Those debris on the edge,followed by vegetation or your "mole" tile.Using that tile at 45degrees on corners gives a great impression of roundness.(radarmaps look gorgeous).
Plus, the fact that the vegetation or fence is followed by those big crates gives an ilusion of volume, of continuity to the hight of the roof.
Of course, I'd still need more crates,the other boats,transporters, cranes to give an industrial aspect...

Re: Game world and mapmaking[message #127170] Tue, 22 August 2006 23:21 Go to previous messageGo to next message
the scorpion

 
Messages:1836
Registered:September 2004
Location: CH
there is a crane but it's not very sexy and it's huge

if you ask me the dock looks great. i for one would certainly like to play them like that

oh, concerning the maps: the GAME EXE from 1.13 didn't load them! not the editor?

it was complaining about corrupted files or such. extremely weird. i think it might be related to the locks from WF maps and will try if deleting them helps.

as a small hint

some lakeobj. sti files don't fit shallow, others don't fit deep water, always camouflage the wrong ones with a matching one or with high leafs
Re: Game world and mapmaking[message #127171] Wed, 23 August 2006 00:44 Go to previous messageGo to next message
AZAZEL

 
Messages:750
Registered:February 2004
Editor tutorial by Wodan should be already in your mailbox.

Ja-ja. Smile
That's a sketch, with everything crowded in that corner of the map.If you ask me, there's too much "detail" there already.Rows are too close. You can still pass through vegetation, or those debris that look like concrete fragments from "queen prison" though.
My idea of a decent tileset for ports would be:
-water:"tropical" colour,a little darker than that of "tropical port" or "queen prison", not as dark as "grumm", or "drassen":deep blue.If lighter colour needed some lights could be placed.
-that yellowish debris you used for oil spots or something like that instead of "dry,cracked land" that I used on water edges.(need sand,not that)
-current tropical port floors(those dark browns make a good contrast)
-some furniture,enough for an office or something
-all available kinds of crates, and those smaller yellow boxes.
-that little machine that caries them(available in "queen prison"
-all boats
-that beauty of a white minaret from "arab city", to pose as lighthouse.

Can we assemble that?Erm, I ment "you" Smile
Of course, I could continue that way:it can be said that once somebody is told that's a port, and sees boats these tricky human minds begin searching known patterns, and one ends up creating an complete-coherent image even from unmatching fragments:imagination fills in,with some friendly complicity.

Re: Game world and mapmaking[message #127172] Wed, 23 August 2006 01:40 Go to previous messageGo to next message
the scorpion

 
Messages:1836
Registered:September 2004
Location: CH
i think we can ditch the cranes and industial stuff from that tilesets, you never use so it so it doens't match

if you want a lighthouse, i' ll edit the minarett to a lighthouse. that^ll take some time. plus i gotta check if i have already used coastal port in the current game. if yes only few edits can be made, if no, we can still try around especially since g1 h1 don't load

in fact the light house idea is quite creative.
Re: Game world and mapmaking[message #127173] Wed, 23 August 2006 03:08 Go to previous messageGo to next message
borout

 
Messages:38
Registered:November 2004
Location: Slovenia
I am salivating at the expectation of Renegade Republik....
Re: Game world and mapmaking[message #127174] Wed, 23 August 2006 07:29 Go to previous messageGo to next message
the scorpion

 
Messages:1836
Registered:September 2004
Location: CH
damn me too

anybody knows when it^s gonna be released?


Wink


Sad
Re: Game world and mapmaking[message #127175] Wed, 23 August 2006 09:01 Go to previous messageGo to next message
AZAZEL

 
Messages:750
Registered:February 2004
Depends.
X-mass time??
Quoting from a classic:"brewski time".

Re: Game world and mapmaking[message #127176] Wed, 23 August 2006 17:57 Go to previous messageGo to next message
the scorpion

 
Messages:1836
Registered:September 2004
Location: CH
x-mas would be great. i could make hard copies and give my friends instead of real gifts...


...on the other hand, that is an optimistic guess
Re: Game world and mapmaking[message #127177] Wed, 23 August 2006 22:26 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Mauser

 
Messages:769
Registered:August 2006
Location: Bavaria - Germany
just a little question scorpion: are you going to change the worldmap and locations of cities and their sectors and names or will they stay as in vanilla JA2?

i really hope you do change them, so they fit the new scenario better!

other than that, the new maps look really cool and i can

☆★GL★☆
Re: Game world and mapmaking[message #127178] Wed, 23 August 2006 23:31 Go to previous messageGo to next message
the scorpion

 
Messages:1836
Registered:September 2004
Location: CH
good questions. the last one i'm not sure. The features we need are not yet in 1.13. once 1.13 has these features, we'd be smart to use the very latest exe. current exe is older though, this is becasue i don't have the time to update all xml files

yes, i'm planning to change the city borders and names, but again, for this i need a final exe to work with. The city names will fit the scenario

we're working on the strategic map. it should portray the geographical region where the mod plays roughly.

sorry, most of the maps don't work with vanilla ja2 and the other maps you can take them from ja2 vengeance mod if you like. adjusting them to 1.13 would not be a huge task. just some npc placements (plus getting rid of those maps that don't work wiht 1.13)
Re: Game world and mapmaking[message #127179] Thu, 24 August 2006 18:34 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Vicky

 
Messages:66
Registered:January 2006
Location: New Zealand
Okay computer and editor are both working so feel free to send on the files I need to make some maps for RR. Have done some playing around and feel pretty confident at working it.
Re: Game world and mapmaking[message #127180] Thu, 24 August 2006 20:31 Go to previous messageGo to next message
the scorpion

 
Messages:1836
Registered:September 2004
Location: CH
great. more stuff coming your way in that case.

including a tutorial Azazel has sent.
Re: Game world and mapmaking[message #127181] Thu, 24 August 2006 20:58 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Vicky

 
Messages:66
Registered:January 2006
Location: New Zealand
as i just emailed you:

I think my install for the editor might be missing some things.. It doesnt have a binarydata folder nor a tilesets folder.. Do i need to make new ones or is my install just a bit bunged up?
Re: Game world and mapmaking[message #127182] Thu, 24 August 2006 21:08 Go to previous messageGo to next message
AZAZEL

 
Messages:750
Registered:February 2004
Yes, you have the files, they are in the bynarydata.SLF and tilesets.slf.(special kinds of archives)
But that editor has also a "unslf" thing, that makes it read from the special archives.Now you don't need anything else to make maps in original tilesets.
Do create a folder called MAPS in the DATA folder, or you won't have where to save your work.

If Scorp sent you the custom tilesets you need to make a new and normal "Bynarydata" folder(containing JA2SET.DAT) and "Tilesets" folder to place both in ja2/DATA folder.
Luckily, the big bug called "program" still prefers fresh meat to the conserved one. Wink
No maliciousness.You'll get used to it.

Ah, please consult Wodan's introduction and don't try to burn stages(like I did) and rush things, it would probably only lead to more time spent to really learn hot to do things.
Allright, lunch break over.
Happy editing!

Re: Game world and mapmaking[message #127183] Thu, 24 August 2006 21:13 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Vicky

 
Messages:66
Registered:January 2006
Location: New Zealand
No worries I really appreciate the help. I realise I'm asking silly questions I just wanted to ensure I was doing the right thing.

Edit: Thanks again for wasting your time helping me to do things I should really know how to do myself.. I'll try not to jump ahead of myself but no promises. I'll probably be heading to bed soon myself..
Re: Game world and mapmaking[message #127184] Thu, 24 August 2006 21:56 Go to previous messageGo to next message
the scorpion

 
Messages:1836
Registered:September 2004
Location: CH
"binarydata" az just one "y" Wink

yes, if these folder don't yet exist, you can create them. ja2 first checks if a file in a folder exists, if not, it checks the slf archives

so in a fresh install you have hardly any folders, but mostly archives

so there's nothing wrong with your installation, just me i had to hurry somwhere and left out the important details. i'm back on the comp for 7 or so more minutes now

you're definitly not wasting my time. I had huge hassles getting into mapmaking back in the days and i had to ask a lot of questions as well. The ja2 community has always been eager to help new players or modmakers. I lack the communicative skills to give info and be friendly both at once, that's why my answers are sometimes sounding a bit ... err ... straight to the point.
Re: Game world and mapmaking[message #127185] Thu, 24 August 2006 22:06 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Vicky

 
Messages:66
Registered:January 2006
Location: New Zealand
Nah not to worry Scorpion, when i get stressed out a straight to the point answer is exactly what i need! Ive got it all working now but I might head to bed and will attack it with a clear mind tomorrow.

Oh yeah.. any specific coordinates and ideas for them you want me to attack or should I just made a generic map which you can do with what you want?

I think i know everything I need to do.. enemy voicing, look at the other character you gave me, get adam's voicing and editing done and some maps too Smile sounds like fun! If only I could make some money doing it too.. Razz ohh to dream.

As a final note you guys have all been really helpful. Im sure you've reached the point scorpion where you dread checking your emails in case there is one (or eight) from me! Razz But i really do appreciate it. Its been heaps of fun.
Re: Game world and mapmaking[message #127186] Thu, 24 August 2006 22:32 Go to previous messageGo to next message
the scorpion

 
Messages:1836
Registered:September 2004
Location: CH
great to hear. i think my recent postings are okay as answers for your mails as well?

i'll think of specific mapping you can do. In fact this is a bit complicated (as azazel knows) to coordinate, but there are various possibilities of what you can work on the editor. i'll let you know oncei have come up with some suggestions.

the custom tilesets work? do you see the boats/ new vehicles/ new buildings in the editor? they are of course in various different tilesets

have fun with that Wink
Re: Game world and mapmaking[message #127187] Fri, 25 August 2006 07:29 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Vicky

 
Messages:66
Registered:January 2006
Location: New Zealand
I assume the custom tilesets work. I can open the various things like "tropical 1" etc now which i couldnt do before. So yes I'm all up and running with a larger harddrive which will be extremely handy by the sounds of it!
Re: Game world and mapmaking[message #127188] Tue, 29 August 2006 19:49 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Vicky

 
Messages:66
Registered:January 2006
Location: New Zealand
Okay a few more problems sorry..

Scorpion has sent me all the latest files etc. I'm not sure if this includes any maps etc that have already been done but i assume so? My editor can't read them at all. So what I'm going to do is do some screen prints so you can see how its all installed on my computer and if I've not done something. If you could help I'd appreciate it Smile Thanks!!

http://img220.imageshack.us/img220/3951/mapeditorfolderfo3.th.gif

http://img201.imageshack.us/img201/3310/datavi1.th.gif
Re: Game world and mapmaking[message #127189] Tue, 29 August 2006 20:00 Go to previous messageGo to next message
the scorpion

 
Messages:1836
Registered:September 2004
Location: CH
i only sent you tilesets. no custom maps.
Re: Game world and mapmaking[message #127190] Tue, 29 August 2006 20:04 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Vicky

 
Messages:66
Registered:January 2006
Location: New Zealand
Oh okay so I'm not meant to be able to see whats already been done? All good then alright.. then I think everything is working..

This is the opening screen of the editor. I think everything is going alright. I'll get making then!

http://img219.imageshack.us/img219/9850/editorwj8.th.gif
Re: Game world and mapmaking[message #127191] Tue, 29 August 2006 20:42 Go to previous messageGo to next message
the scorpion

 
Messages:1836
Registered:September 2004
Location: CH
so far, everything looks okay.

i can't send all the maps.... as a matter of fact, the ja2 editor only supports 50 tilesets

ja2 1.13, the game we use a sengine for our mod, supports 256

i have maps from 69 different tilesets, that means having more than just one editor install (in fact i use 3 differen ones currently, UC tilesets, rr custom tilesets and vengeance based rr tilesets)

i thouhgt that would get a bit too complicated. but i can provide you the maps surrounding the area (in case they're already up-to date)

i should do that for AZ as well, but the maps aren't all updated...

*edit*

i take it from your last email that loading map files is now working.
Re: Game world and mapmaking[message #127192] Tue, 05 September 2006 03:13 Go to previous messageGo to previous message
AZAZEL

 
Messages:750
Registered:February 2004
Building tilesets and borrowing from other people's mods is a job I'd gladly delegate.
Rather stick to playing. Smile
http://xrmb2.net/img/images/432639.jpeg

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